§274ΣΩ. οὐ γὰρ δὴ ἄρα, ὦ Τεισία, φασὶν οἱ σοφώτεροι ἡμῶν, ὁμοδούλοις δεῖ χαρίζεσθαι μελετᾶν τὸν νοῦν ἔχοντα, ὅτι μὴ πάρεργον, ἀλλὰ δεσπόταις ἀγαθοῖς τε καὶ ἐξ ἀγαθῶν.
SOCRATES: For indeed, Tisias, those who are wiser than we say that one who has understanding must not practice pleasing fellow slaves, except as a secondary task, but rather good masters and those born of good masters.
ὥστʼ εἰ μακρὰ ἡ περίοδος, μὴ θαυμάσῃς· μεγάλων γὰρ ἕνεκα περιιτέον, οὐχ ὡς σὺ δοκεῖς.
Therefore, if the circuit is long, do not wonder; for it is for the sake of great things that we must go around, and not as you think.
ἔσται μήν, ὡς ὁ λόγος φησίν, ἐάν τις ἐθέλῃ, καὶ ταῦτα κάλλιστα ἐξ ἐκείνων γιγνόμενα.
Yet, as the argument says, if one is willing, these things too will become most beautiful as a result of those.
ΦΑΙ. παγκάλως ἔμοιγε δοκεῖ λέγεσθαι, ὦ Σώκρατες, εἴπερ οἷός τέ τις εἴη.
PHAEDRUS: It seems to me, Socrates, to be very beautifully said, if indeed one were able to do it.
ΣΩ. ἀλλὰ καὶ ἐπιχειροῦντί τοι τοῖς καλοῖς καλὸν καὶ πάσχειν ὅτι ἄν τῳ συμβῇ παθεῖν.
SOCRATES: But to one who attempts beautiful things, it is also beautiful to suffer whatever it may happen to him to suffer.
ΦΑΙ. καὶ μάλα.
PHAEDRUS: Very much so.
ΣΩ. οὐκοῦν τὸ μὲν τέχνης τε καὶ ἀτεχνίας λόγων πέρι ἱκανῶς ἐχέτω.
SOCRATES: Let this, then, suffice concerning art and lack of art in speeches.
ΦΑΙ. τί μήν;
PHAEDRUS: Of course.
ΣΩ. τὸ δʼ εὐπρεπείας δὴ γραφῆς πέρι καὶ ἀπρεπείας, πῇ γιγνόμενον καλῶς ἂν ἔχοι καὶ ὅπῃ ἀπρεπῶς, λοιπόν.
SOCRATES: But as for the propriety and impropriety of writing, in what way it is done well and in what way improperly, this remains.
ἦ γάρ;
Is it not so?
ΦΑΙ. ναί.
PHAEDRUS: Yes.
ΣΩ. οἶσθʼ οὖν ὅπῃ μάλιστα θεῷ χαριῇ λόγων πέρι πράττων ἢ λέγων;
SOCRATES: Do you know then how you might best please God in acting or speaking concerning speeches?
ΦΑΙ. οὐδαμῶς· σὺ δέ;
PHAEDRUS: Not at all; do you?
ΣΩ. ἀκοήν γʼ ἔχω λέγειν τῶν προτέρων, τὸ δʼ ἀληθὲς αὐτοὶ ἴσασιν.
SOCRATES: I have at least a hearsay from those before us to tell, but they themselves know the truth.
εἰ δὲ τοῦτο εὕροιμεν αὐτοί, ἆρά γʼ ἂν ἔθʼ ἡμῖν μέλοι τι τῶν ἀνθρωπίνων δοξασμάτων;
If we should find this ourselves, would we still care at all for human opinions?
ΦΑΙ. γελοῖον ἤρου· ἀλλʼ ἃ φῂς ἀκηκοέναι λέγε.
PHAEDRUS: You ask a ridiculous question; but tell what you say you have heard.
ΣΩ. ἤκουσα τοίνυν περὶ Ναύκρατιν τῆς Αἰγύπτου γενέσθαι τῶν ἐκεῖ παλαιῶν τινα θεῶν, οὗ καὶ τὸ ὄρνεον ἱερὸν ὃ δὴ καλοῦσιν Ἶβιν· αὐτῷ δὲ ὄνομα τῷ δαίμονι εἶναι Θεύθ.
SOCRATES: I heard, then, that in the region of Naucratis in Egypt, there was one of the ancient gods of that place, to whom also the bird called the Ibis was sacred; and the name of this divinity was Theuth.
τοῦτον δὴ πρῶτον ἀριθμόν τε καὶ λογισμὸν εὑρεῖν καὶ γεωμετρίαν καὶ ἀστρονομίαν, ἔτι δὲ πεττείας τε καὶ κυβείας, καὶ δὴ καὶ γράμματα.
They say that he first discovered number and calculation, geometry and astronomy, and further, draughts and dice, and above all, letters.
βασιλέως δʼ αὖ τότε ὄντος Αἰγύπτου ὅλης Θαμοῦ περὶ τὴν μεγάλην πόλιν τοῦ ἄνω τόπου ἣν οἱ Ἕλληνες Αἰγυπτίας Θήβας καλοῦσι, καὶ τὸν θεὸν Ἄμμωνα, παρὰ τοῦτον ἐλθὼν ὁ Θεὺθ τὰς τέχνας ἐπέδειξεν, καὶ ἔφη δεῖν διαδοθῆναι τοῖς ἄλλοις Αἰγυπτίοις·
Now at that time Thamus was king of all Egypt, living in the great city of the upper region which the Greeks call Egyptian Thebes, and they call its god Ammon.
ὁ δὲ ἤρετο ἥντινα ἑκάστη ἔχοι ὠφελίαν, διεξιόντος δέ, ὅτι καλῶς ἢ μὴ καλῶς δοκοῖ λέγειν, τὸ μὲν ἔψεγεν, τὸ δʼ ἐπῄνει.
Theuth came to him and showed him his arts, and said they ought to be distributed to the other Egyptians.
πολλὰ μὲν δὴ περὶ ἑκάστης τῆς τέχνης ἐπʼ ἀμφότερα Θαμοῦν τῷ Θεὺθ λέγεται ἀποφήνασθαι, ἃ λόγος πολὺς ἂν εἴη διελθεῖν·
Thamus asked what benefit each possessed, and as Theuth went through them, he blamed some and praised others, according as he thought they were well or ill spoken of.
ἐπειδὴ δὲ ἐπὶ τοῖς γράμμασιν ἦν,
τοῦτο δέ, ὦ βασιλεῦ, τὸ μάθημα,
ἔφη ὁ Θεύθ,
σοφωτέρους Αἰγυπτίους καὶ μνημονικωτέρους παρέξει· μνήμης τε γὰρ καὶ σοφίας φάρμακον ηὑρέθη.
Now Thamus is said to have declared many things to Theuth on both sides concerning each art, which it would be a long story to run through; but when he came to letters, "This study, O King," said Theuth, "will make the Egyptians wiser and improve their memory; for a medicine for memory and wisdom has been found." SOCRATES: But the other replied: "O most ingenious Theuth, one man is able to give birth to the things of art, but another to judge what share of harm and benefit they possess for those who are going to use them.
§275ΣΩ. ὁ δʼ εἶπεν· ὦ τεχνικώτατε Θεύθ, ἄλλος μὲν τεκεῖν δυνατὸς τὰ τέχνης, ἄλλος δὲ κρῖναι τίνʼ ἔχει μοῖραν βλάβης τε καὶ ὠφελίας τοῖς μέλλουσι χρῆσθαι· καὶ νῦν σύ, πατὴρ ὢν γραμμάτων, διʼ εὔνοιαν τοὐναντίον εἶπες ἢ δύναται.
And now, you, being the father of letters, have out of goodwill said the opposite of what they can do.
τοῦτο γὰρ τῶν μαθόντων λήθην μὲν ἐν ψυχαῖς παρέξει μνήμης ἀμελετησίᾳ, ἅτε διὰ πίστιν γραφῆς ἔξωθεν ὑπʼ ἀλλοτρίων τύπων, οὐκ ἔνδοθεν αὐτοὺς ὑφʼ αὑτῶν ἀναμιμνῃσκομένους·
For this will provide forgetfulness in the souls of those who learn it through neglect of memory, inasmuch as, trusting in writing, they will remember from without by means of foreign marks, not from within by themselves.
οὔκουν μνήμης ἀλλὰ ὑπομνήσεως φάρμακον ηὗρες.
You have found, then, a medicine not for memory, but for reminding.
σοφίας δὲ τοῖς μαθηταῖς δόξαν, οὐκ ἀλήθειαν πορίζεις· πολυήκοοι γάρ σοι γενόμενοι ἄνευ διδαχῆς πολυγνώμονες εἶναι δόξουσιν, ἀγνώμονες ὡς ἐπὶ τὸ πλῆθος ὄντες, καὶ χαλεποὶ συνεῖναι, δοξόσοφοι γεγονότες ἀντὶ σοφῶν. ΦΑΙ. ὦ Σώκρατες, ῥᾳδίως σὺ Αἰγυπτίους καὶ ὁποδαποὺς ἂν ἐθέλῃς λόγους ποιεῖς.
And you provide your disciples with the reputation of wisdom, not the truth; for having become hearers of many things without instruction, they will seem to be wise in many things while being for the most part ignorant, and they will be difficult to get along with, having become wise in opinion instead of wise." PHAEDRUS: O Socrates, you easily make up speeches about Egypt or any country you please.
ΣΩ. οἱ δέ γʼ, ὦ φίλε, ἐν τῷ τοῦ Διὸς τοῦ Δωδωναίου ἱερῷ δρυὸς λόγους ἔφησαν μαντικοὺς πρώτους γενέσθαι.
SOCRATES: But, my friend, those in the temple of Zeus at Dodona said that the first prophetic words came from an oak.
τοῖς μὲν οὖν τότε, ἅτε οὐκ οὖσι σοφοῖς ὥσπερ ὑμεῖς οἱ νέοι, ἀπέχρη δρυὸς καὶ πέτρας ἀκούειν ὑπʼ εὐηθείας, εἰ μόνον ἀληθῆ λέγοιεν· σοὶ δʼ ἴσως διαφέρει τίς ὁ λέγων καὶ ποδαπός.
To the men of that time, then, since they were not wise like you young people, it was enough in their simplicity to listen to an oak or a rock, if only they spoke the truth; but to you perhaps it makes a difference who the speaker is and from where he comes.
οὐ γὰρ ἐκεῖνο μόνον σκοπεῖς, εἴτε οὕτως εἴτε ἄλλως ἔχει;
For do you not look only at that, whether the matter is so or otherwise?
ΦΑΙ. ὀρθῶς ἐπέπληξας, καί μοι δοκεῖ περὶ γραμμάτων ἔχειν ᾗπερ ὁ Θηβαῖος λέγει.
PHAEDRUS: You have rightly rebuked me, and it seems to me to be concerning letters just as the Theban says.
ΣΩ. οὐκοῦν ὁ τέχνην οἰόμενος ἐν γράμμασι καταλιπεῖν, καὶ αὖ ὁ παραδεχόμενος ὥς τι σαφὲς καὶ βέβαιον ἐκ γραμμάτων ἐσόμενον, πολλῆς ἂν εὐηθείας γέμοι καὶ τῷ ὄντι τὴν Ἄμμωνος μαντείαν ἀγνοοῖ, πλέον τι οἰόμενος εἶναι λόγους γεγραμμένους τοῦ τὸν εἰδότα ὑπομνῆσαι περὶ ὧν ἂν ᾖ τὰ γεγραμμένα.
SOCRATES: Therefore, he who thinks he has left an art behind in writing, and again he who accepts it as if something clear and solid will result from letters, would be full of much simplicity, and in truth ignorant of the prophecy of Ammon, thinking that written words are something more than a reminder to the one who knows about the things written.
ΦΑΙ. ὀρθότατα.
PHAEDRUS: Most correctly.
ΣΩ. δεινὸν γάρ που, ὦ Φαῖδρε, τοῦτʼ ἔχει γραφή, καὶ ὡς ἀληθῶς ὅμοιον ζωγραφίᾳ.
SOCRATES: For this, Phaedrus, is the strange thing about writing, and truly like painting.
καὶ γὰρ τὰ ἐκείνης ἔκγονα ἕστηκε μὲν ὡς ζῶντα, ἐὰν δʼ ἀνέρῃ τι, σεμνῶς πάνυ σιγᾷ.
For its offspring stand as if alive, but if you ask them something, they keep a very solemn silence.
ταὐτὸν δὲ καὶ οἱ λόγοι· δόξαις μὲν ἂν ὥς τι φρονοῦντας αὐτοὺς λέγειν, ἐὰν δέ τι ἔρῃ τῶν λεγομένων βουλόμενος μαθεῖν, ἕν τι σημαίνει μόνον ταὐτὸν ἀεί.
And it is the same with speeches; you would think they speak as if they had some understanding, but if you ask about any of the things said, wishing to learn, they point to one and same thing always.
ὅταν δὲ ἅπαξ γραφῇ, κυλινδεῖται μὲν πανταχοῦ πᾶς λόγος ὁμοίως παρὰ τοῖς ἐπαΐουσιν, ὡς δʼ αὕτως παρʼ οἷς οὐδὲν προσήκει, καὶ οὐκ ἐπίσταται λέγειν οἷς δεῖ γε καὶ μή.
And when it is once written, every speech rolls about everywhere, equally among those who understand it and likewise among those for whom it is not fitting, and it does not know to whom it ought to speak and to whom not.
πλημμελούμενος δὲ καὶ οὐκ ἐν δίκῃ λοιδορηθεὶς τοῦ πατρὸς ἀεὶ δεῖται βοηθοῦ· αὐτὸς γὰρ οὔτʼ ἀμύνασθαι οὔτε βοηθῆσαι δυνατὸς αὑτῷ.
And when it is ill-treated and unjustly abused, it always needs its father to help; for it is unable to defend itself or help itself.
ΦΑΙ. καὶ ταῦτά σοι ὀρθότατα εἴρηται.
PHAEDRUS: And this also you have said most correctly.