§23Χρύσιππος
ἀλλὰ μὴν αὐτὸς οὗτος ἦν ὁ πατὴρ ὁ σός· ὥστε εἰ τοῦτον ἀγνοεῖς, δῆλος εἶ τὸν πατέρα τὸν σὸν ἀγνοῶν.
Chrysippus But indeed, this very person was your father; so that if you do not know him, you are clearly ignorant of your own father.
Ἀγοράστης
οὐ μὲν οὖν· ἀλλʼ ἀποκαλύψας αὐτὸν εἴσομαι τὴν ἀλήθειαν.
Buyer Not at all; but once I unveil him, I shall know the truth.
ὅμως δʼ οὖν τί σοι τῆς σοφίας τὸ τέλος, ἢ τί πράξεις πρὸς τὸ ἀκρότατον τῆς ἀρετῆς ἀφικόμενος;
But anyway, what is the goal of your wisdom, or what will you do when you reach the highest point of virtue?
Χρύσιππος
περὶ τὰ πρῶτα κατὰ φύσιν τότε γενήσομαι, λέγω δὲ πλοῦτον, ὑγίειαν καὶ τὰ τοιαῦτα.
Chrysippus Then I shall be concerned with the primary things according to nature—I mean wealth, health, and such things.
πρότερον δὲ ἀνάγκη πολλὰ προπονῆσαι λεπτογράφοις βιβλίοις παραθήγοντα τὴν ὄψιν καὶ σχόλια συναγείροντα καὶ σολοικισμῶν ἐμπιπλάμενον καὶ ἀτόπων ῥημάτων· καὶ τὸ κεφάλαιον, οὐ θέμις γενέσθαι σοφόν, ἢν μὴ τρὶς ἐφεξῆς τοῦ ἐλλεβόρου πίῃς.
But before that, it is necessary to toil much beforehand, sharpening one's eyesight on finely written books, gathering notes, and filling oneself with solecisms and strange words; and to sum up, it is not permitted to become wise unless you drink hellebore three times in succession.
Ἀγοράστης
γενναῖά σου ταῦτα καὶ δεινῶς ἀνδρικά.
Buyer Noble are these things of yours, and terribly manly!
τὸ δὲ Γνίφωνα εἶναι καὶ τοκογλύφον — καὶ γὰρ τάδε ὁρῶ σοι προσόντα — τί φῶμεν, ἀνδρὸς ἤδη πεπωκότος τὸν ἐλλέβορον καὶ τελείου πρὸς ἀρετήν;
But as for being a miser and a usurer—for indeed I see these qualities belong to you—what shall we say of them, in a man who has already drunk hellebore and is perfect in virtue?
Χρύσιππος
ναί· μόνῳ γοῦν τὸ δανείζειν πρέποι ἂν τῷ σοφῷ·
Chrysippus Yes; at any rate, lending money would be appropriate only for the wise man.
ἐπεὶ γὰρ ἴδιον αὐτοῦ συλλογίζεσθαι, τὸ δανείζειν δὲ καὶ λογίζεσθαι τοὺς τόκους πλησίον εἶναι δοκεῖ τῷ συλλογίζεσθαι, μόνου ἂν εἴη τοῦ σπουδαίου καθάπερ ἐκεῖνο καὶ τοῦτο, καὶ οὐ μόνον γε ἁπλοῦς, ὥσπερ οἱ ἄλλοι, τοὺς τόκους, ἀλλὰ καὶ τούτων ἑτέρους τόκους λαμβάνειν·
For since reasoning is proper to him, and lending money and calculating interest seem to be close to reasoning, this just as much as that would belong only to the virtuous man.
ἢ γὰρ ἀγνοεῖς ὅτι τῶν τόκων οἱ μέν εἰσι πρῶτοί τινες, οἱ δὲ δεύτεροι, καθάπερ αὐτῶν ἐκείνων ἀπόγονοι;
And indeed, not only to take simple interest, like other people, but also other interest upon this interest; for are you ignorant that of interest, some is primary, and some secondary, just like the offspring of those themselves?
ὁρᾷς δὲ δὴ καὶ τὸν συλλογισμὸν ὁποῖά φησιν· εἰ τὸν πρῶτον τόκον λήψεται, λήψεται καὶ τὸν δεύτερον· ἀλλὰ μὴν τὸν πρῶτον λήψεται, λήψεται ἄρα καὶ τὸν δεύτερον· . §24Ἀγοράστης
οὐκοῦν καὶ μισθῶν πέρι τὰ αὐτὰ φῶμεν, οὓς σὺ λαμβάνεις ἐπὶ τῇ σοφίᾳ παρὰ τῶν νέων, καὶ δῆλον ὅτι μόνος ὁ σπουδαῖος μισθὸν ἐπὶ τῇ ἀρετῇ λήψεται;
And indeed you see what the syllogism says: "If he will receive the primary interest, he will also receive the secondary; but indeed he will receive the primary, therefore he will also receive the secondary." Buyer Therefore, shall we say the same about fees, which you receive for wisdom from the young, and is it clear that only the virtuous man will receive a fee for virtue?
Χρύσιππος
μανθάνεις·
Chrysippus You understand.
οὐ γὰρ ἐμαυτοῦ ἕνεκα λαμβάνω, τοῦ δὲ διδόντος αὐτοῦ χάριν·
For I do not receive it for my own sake, but for the sake of the giver himself.
ἐπεὶ γάρ ἐστιν ὁ μέν τις ἐκχύτης, ὁ δὲ περιεκτικός, ἐμαυτὸν μὲν ἀσκῶ εἶναι περιεκτικόν, τὸν δὲ μαθητὴν ἐκχύτην.
For since one person is a pourer-out and another is a container, I train myself to be a container, and the student to be a pourer-out.
Ἀγοράστης
καὶ μὴν τοὐναντίον ἐχρῆν τὸν νέον μὲν εἶναι περιεκτικόν, σὲ δὲ τὸν μόνον πλούσιον ἐκχύτην.
Buyer And yet, on the contrary, the youth ought to be the container, and you, the only rich man, the pourer-out.
Χρύσιππος
σκώπτεις, ὦ οὗτος.
Chrysippus You are joking, fellow.
ἀλλʼ ὅρα μή σε ἀποτοξεύσω τῷ ἀναποδείκτῳ συλλογισμῷ.
But take care lest I shoot you down with an indemonstrable syllogism.
Ἀγοράστης
καὶ τί δεινὸν ἀπὸ τοῦ βέλους;
Buyer And what is the danger from the arrow?
Χρύσιππος
ἀπορία καὶ σιωπὴ καὶ διαστραφῆναι τὴν διάνοιαν.
Chrysippus Perplexity, and silence, and the mind being turned inside out.
§25Χρύσιππος
ὃ δὲ μέγιστον, ἢν ἐθέλω, τάχιστά σε ἀποδείξω λίθον.
Chrysippus And what is greatest, if I wish, I shall very quickly prove you to be a stone.
Ἀγοράστης
πῶς λίθον;
Buyer How a stone?
οὐ γὰρ Περσεὺς σύ, ὦ βέλτιστε, εἶναί μοι δοκεῖς.
For you do not seem to me, my good sir, to be Perseus.
Χρύσιππος
ὧδέ πως· ὁ λίθος σῶμά ἐστι;
Chrysippus Like this: is a stone a body?
Ἀγοράστης
ναί.
Buyer Yes.
Χρύσιππος
τί δέ;
Chrysippus And what?
τὸ ζῷον οὐ σῶμα;
Is a living thing not a body?
Ἀγοράστης
ναί.
Buyer Yes.
Χρύσιππος
σὺ δὲ ζῷον;
Chrysippus And are you a living thing?
Ἀγοράστης
ἔοικα γοῦν.
Buyer It seems so, at least.
Χρύσιππος
λίθος ἄρα εἶ σῶμα ὤν.
Chrysippus Therefore you are a stone, being a body.
Ἀγοράστης
μηδαμῶς.
Buyer Not at all!
ἀλλʼ ἀνάλυσόν με πρὸς τοῦ Διὸς καὶ ἐξ ὑπαρχῆς ποίησον ἄνθρωπον.
But release me, by Zeus, and make me a human being from the start again.
Χρύσιππος
οὐ χαλεπόν·
Chrysippus It is not difficult.
ἀλλʼ ἔμπαλιν ἴσθι ἄνθρωπος.
But be a human being again.
εἰπὲ γάρ μοι, πᾶν σῶμα ζῷον;
For tell me, is every body a living thing?
Ἀγοράστης
οὔ.
Buyer No.
Χρύσιππος
τί δέ;
Chrysippus And what?
λίθος ζῷον;
Is a stone a living thing?
Ἀγοράστης
οὔ.
Buyer No.
Χρύσιππος
σὺ δὲ σῶμα εἶ;
Chrysippus And are you a body?
Ἀγοράστης
ναί.
Buyer Yes.
Χρύσιππος
σῶμα δὲ ὢν ζῷον εἶ;
Chrysippus And being a body, are you a living thing?
Ἀγοράστης
ναί.
Buyer Yes.
Χρύσιππος
οὐκ ἄρα λίθος εἶ ζῷόν γε ὤν.
Chrysippus Therefore you are not a stone, since you are a living thing.
Ἀγοράστης
εὖ γε ἐποίησας, ὡς ἤδη μου τὰ σκέλη καθάπερ τῆς Νιόβης ἀπεψύχετο καὶ πάγια ἦν.
Buyer You have done well, for already my legs, just like Niobe's, were growing cold and becoming fixed.
ἀλλὰ ὠνήσομαί γε σέ.
But I will buy you anyway.
πόσον ὑπὲρ αὐτοῦ καταβαλῶ;
How much shall I pay for him?
Ἑρμῆς
μνᾶς δώδεκα.
Hermes Twelve minae.
Ἀγοράστης
λάμβανε.
Buyer Take it.
Ἑρμῆς
μόνος δὲ αὐτὸν ἐώνησαι;
Hermes And have you bought him alone?
Ἀγοράστης
μὰ Δίʼ, ἀλλʼ οὗτοι πάντες οὓς ὁρᾷς.
Buyer By Zeus, no, but all these whom you see.
Ἑρμῆς
πολλοί γε καὶ τοὺς ὤμους καρτεροὶ καὶ τοῦ θερίζοντος ἄξιοι.
Hermes They are many indeed, and strong in their shoulders, and worthy of "the Reaper"!