§1.643ΚΛ. τότʼ οὖν ἐξενώθησαν ὑμῖν οἱ πρόγονοι ἡμῶν, καὶ εὔνοιαν ἐκ τόσου ἔγωγε ὑμῖν καὶ οἱ ἡμέτεροι ἔχουσιν γονῆς.
CL. Cleinias: It was then, therefore, that our ancestors became guest-friends with you, and from that very time both I myself and our family have had goodwill toward you.
ΑΘ. τὰ μὲν τοίνυν ὑμέτερα ἀκούειν, ὡς ἔοικεν, ἕτοιμʼ ἂν εἴη· τὰ δʼ ἐμὰ βούλεσθαι μὲν ἕτοιμα, δύνασθαι δὲ οὐ πάνυ ῥᾴδια, ὅμως δὲ πειρατέον.
¦643a ATH. Athenian: Then your stories, as it seems, are ready to be heard; but as for mine, though the willingness is ready, the ability is not altogether easy, yet we must make the attempt.
πρῶτον δὴ οὖν πρὸς τὸν λόγον ὁρισώμεθα παιδείαν τί ποτʼ ἐστὶν καὶ τίνα δύναμιν ἔχει· διὰ γὰρ ταύτης φαμὲν ἰτέον εἶναι τὸν προκεχειρισμένον ἐν τῷ νῦν λόγον ὑφʼ ἡμῶν, μέχριπερ ἂν πρὸς τὸν θεὸν ἀφίκηται.
First of all, then, for the sake of our discussion, let us define what education is and what power it has; for we say that the argument we have now taken in hand must proceed through this, until it reaches the god.
ΚΛ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν δρῶμεν ταῦτα, εἴπερ σοί γε ἡδύ.
CL. Cleinias: By all means let us do so, if indeed it is pleasing to you.
ΑΘ. λέγοντος τοίνυν ἐμοῦ τί ποτε χρὴ φάναι παιδείαν εἶναι, σκέψασθε ἂν ἀρέσκῃ τὸ λεχθέν.
ATH. Athenian: Then, as I speak of what we ought to say education is, consider whether what is said pleases you.
ΚΛ. λέγοις ἄν.
CL. Cleinias: Speak, then.
ΑΘ. λέγω δή, καί φημι τὸν ὁτιοῦν ἀγαθὸν ἄνδρα μέλλοντα ἔσεσθαι τοῦτο αὐτὸ ἐκ παίδων εὐθὺς μελετᾶν δεῖν, παίζοντά τε καὶ σπουδάζοντα ἐν τοῖς τοῦ πράγματος ἑκάστοις προσήκουσιν.
ATH. Athenian: I say, then, and I declare that anyone who is to be good at anything must practice that very thing from his youth immediately, both in play and in earnest, in each of the things appropriate to the matter.
οἷον τὸν μέλλοντα ἀγαθὸν ἔσεσθαι γεωργὸν ἤ τινα οἰκοδόμον, τὸν μὲν οἰκοδομοῦντά τι τῶν παιδείων οἰκοδομημάτων παίζειν χρή, τὸν δʼ αὖ γεωργοῦντα, καὶ ὄργανα ἑκατέρῳ σμικρά, τῶν ἀληθινῶν μιμήματα, παρασκευάζειν τὸν τρέφοντα αὐτῶν ἑκάτερον, καὶ δὴ καὶ τῶν μαθημάτων ὅσα ἀναγκαῖα προμεμαθηκέναι προμανθάνειν, οἷον τέκτονα μετρεῖν ἢ σταθμᾶσθαι καὶ πολεμικὸν ἱππεύειν παίζοντα ἤ τι τῶν τοιούτων ἄλλο ποιοῦντα, καὶ πειρᾶσθαι διὰ τῶν παιδιῶν ἐκεῖσε τρέπειν τὰς ἡδονὰς καὶ ἐπιθυμίας τῶν παίδων, οἷ ἀφικομένους αὐτοὺς δεῖ τέλος ἔχειν.
For instance, he who is to be a good farmer or a builder: the builder must play at building some of the childhood buildings, and the farmer again at farming; and he who nurtures each of them must provide small tools for each, which are imitations of the real ones, and indeed, moreover, they must learn beforehand whatever lessons are necessary to have learned beforehand—for example, the carpenter must learn to measure or use the line, and the warrior to ride, doing this in play or performing some other such activity; and he must try, through these plays, to turn the pleasures and desires of the children to that place where, when they have arrived, they must have their final goal.
κεφάλαιον δὴ παιδείας λέγομεν τὴν ὀρθὴν τροφήν, ἣ τοῦ παίζοντος τὴν ψυχὴν εἰς ἔρωτα μάλιστα ἄξει τούτου ὃ δεήσει γενόμενον ἄνδρʼ αὐτὸν τέλειον εἶναι τῆς τοῦ πράγματος ἀρετῆς·
In short, we say that the chief part of education is correct nurture, which will lead the soul of the playing child most of all to a love of that in which he, when he has become a man, will need to be perfect in the virtue of his trade.
ὁρᾶτε οὖν εἰ μέχρι τούτου γε, ὅπερ εἶπον, ὑμῖν ἀρέσκει τὸ λεχθέν.
See then whether, up to this point at least, as I said, what has been said pleases you.
ΚΛ. πῶς γὰρ οὔ;
CL. Cleinias: For how could it not?
ΑΘ. μὴ τοίνυν μηδʼ ὃ λέγομεν εἶναι παιδείαν ἀόριστον γένηται.
ATH. Athenian: Let us not then leave what we say is education undefined.
νῦν γὰρ ὀνειδίζοντες ἐπαινοῦντές θʼ ἑκάστων τὰς τροφάς, λέγομεν ὡς τὸν μὲν πεπαιδευμένον ἡμῶν ὄντα τινά, τὸν δὲ ἀπαίδευτον ἐνίοτε εἴς τε καπηλείας καὶ ναυκληρίας καὶ ἄλλων τοιούτων μάλα πεπαιδευμένων σφόδρα ἀνθρώπων· οὐ γὰρ ταῦτα ἡγουμένων, ὡς ἔοικʼ, εἶναι παιδείαν ὁ νῦν λόγος ἂν εἴη, τὴν δὲ πρὸς ἀρετὴν ἐκ παίδων παιδείαν, ποιοῦσαν ἐπιθυμητήν τε καὶ ἐραστὴν τοῦ πολίτην γενέσθαι τέλεον, ἄρχειν τε καὶ ἄρχεσθαι ἐπιστάμενον μετὰ δίκης.
For at present, when we censure or praise the nurture of each, we speak of one of us as being educated, and another as uneducated, sometimes even of men who are very highly trained in retail trade or ship-owning and other such pursuits; for, as it seems, the present argument would not consider these things to be education, but rather that education from childhood toward virtue, which makes a man desirous and passionate to become a perfect citizen, knowing how to rule and be ruled with justice.
§1.644ΑΘ. ταύτην τὴν τροφὴν ἀφορισάμενος ὁ λόγος οὗτος, ὡς ἐμοὶ φαίνεται, νῦν βούλοιτʼ ἂν μόνην παιδείαν προσαγορεύειν, τὴν δὲ εἰς χρήματα τείνουσαν ἤ τινα πρὸς ἰσχύν, ἢ καὶ πρὸς ἄλλην τινὰ σοφίαν ἄνευ νοῦ καὶ δίκης, βάναυσόν τʼ εἶναι καὶ ἀνελεύθερον καὶ οὐκ ἀξίαν τὸ παράπαν παιδείαν καλεῖσθαι.
ATH. Athenian: This argument, as it seems to me, having defined this nurture, would now wish to call this alone education, whereas that which tends toward wealth or some strength, or even toward some other wisdom without intelligence and justice, it would call vulgar and illiberal, and not worthy to be called education at all.
ἡμεῖς δὴ μηδὲν ὀνόματι διαφερώμεθʼ αὑτοῖς, ἀλλʼ ὁ νυνδὴ λόγος ἡμῖν ὁμολογηθεὶς μενέτω, ὡς οἵ γε ὀρθῶς πεπαιδευμένοι σχεδὸν ἀγαθοὶ γίγνονται, καὶ δεῖ δὴ τὴν παιδείαν μηδαμοῦ ἀτιμάζειν, ὡς πρῶτον τῶν καλλίστων τοῖς ἀρίστοις ἀνδράσιν παραγιγνόμενον· καὶ εἴ ποτε ἐξέρχεται, δυνατὸν δʼ ἐστὶν ἐπανορθοῦσθαι, τοῦτʼ ἀεὶ δραστέον διὰ βίου παντὶ κατὰ δύναμιν.
Let us indeed not differ with one another about a name, but let the argument just now agreed upon by us stand, namely, that those who are correctly educated generally become good, and that one must by no means dishonor education, since it is the first of the fairest things that come to the best men; and if it ever goes astray, and yet is capable of being corrected, this must always be done throughout life by everyone according to their power.
ΚΛ. ὀρθῶς, καὶ συγχωροῦμεν ἃ λέγεις.
CL. Cleinias: Correct, and we agree with what you say.
ΑΘ. καὶ μὴν πάλαι γε συνεχωρήσαμεν ὡς ἀγαθῶν μὲν ὄντων τῶν δυναμένων ἄρχειν αὑτῶν, κακῶν δὲ τῶν μή.
ATH. Athenian: And indeed, we agreed long ago that those who are able to rule themselves are good, and those who are not are bad.
ΚΛ. λέγεις ὀρθότατα.
CL. Cleinias: You speak most correctly.
ΑΘ. σαφέστερον ἔτι τοίνυν ἀναλάβωμεν τοῦτʼ αὐτὸ ὅτι ποτὲ λέγομεν. καί μοι διʼ εἰκόνος ἀποδέξασθε ἐάν πως δυνατὸς ὑμῖν γένωμαι δηλῶσαι τὸ τοιοῦτον.
ATH. Athenian: Let us then take up this very matter more clearly, as to what on earth we mean by it. And please accept it through an image, if somehow I can manage to explain such a thing to you.
ΚΛ. λέγε μόνον.
CL. Cleinias: Only speak.
ΑΘ. οὐκοῦν ἕνα μὲν ἡμῶν ἕκαστον αὐτὸν τιθῶμεν;
ATH. Athenian: Shall we then assume that each one of us is himself one person?
ΚΛ. ναί.
CL. Cleinias: Yes.
ΑΘ. δύο δὲ κεκτημένον ἐν αὑτῷ συμβούλω ἐναντίω τε καὶ ἄφρονε, ὣ προσαγορεύομεν ἡδονὴν καὶ λύπην;
ATH. Athenian: And possessing in himself two opposite and foolish counselors, which we call pleasure and pain?
ΚΛ. ἔστι ταῦτα.
CL. Cleinias: That is so.
ΑΘ. πρὸς δὲ τούτοιν ἀμφοῖν αὖ δόξας μελλόντων, οἷν κοινὸν μὲν ὄνομα ἐλπίς, ἴδιον δέ, φόβος μὲν ἡ πρὸ λύπης ἐλπίς, θάρρος δὲ ἡ πρὸ τοῦ ἐναντίου· ἐπὶ δὲ πᾶσι τούτοις λογισμὸς ὅτι ποτʼ αὐτῶν ἄμεινον ἢ χεῖρον, ὃς γενόμενος δόγμα πόλεως κοινὸν νόμος ἐπωνόμασται. ΚΛ. μόγις μέν πως ἐφέπομαι, λέγε μὴν τὸ μετὰ ταῦτα ὡς ἑπομένου.
ATH. Athenian: And in addition to these two, again, opinions about future things, whose common name is "expectation," and specifically, "fear" is the expectation before pain, and "confidence" is the expectation before its opposite. And over all these is "calculation," as to which of them is better or worse, which, when it becomes the common decree of the state, is called "law." CL. Cleinias: I follow you with some difficulty indeed, but speak of what follows, on the assumption that I am following.
ΜΕ. καὶ ἐν ἐμοὶ μὴν ταὐτὸν τοῦτο πάθος ἔνι.
ME. Megillus: And indeed in me also this very same state exists.
ΑΘ. περὶ δὴ τούτων διανοηθῶμεν οὑτωσί. θαῦμα μὲν ἕκαστον ἡμῶν ἡγησώμεθα τῶν ζῴων θεῖον, εἴτε ὡς παίγνιον ἐκείνων εἴτε ὡς σπουδῇ τινι συνεστηκός· οὐ γὰρ δὴ τοῦτό γε γιγνώσκομεν, τόδε δὲ ἴσμεν, ὅτι ταῦτα τὰ πάθη ἐν ἡμῖν οἷον νεῦρα ἢ σμήρινθοί τινες ἐνοῦσαι σπῶσίν τε ἡμᾶς καὶ ἀλλήλαις ἀνθέλκουσιν ἐναντίαι οὖσαι ἐπʼ ἐναντίας πράξεις, οὗ δὴ διωρισμένη ἀρετὴ καὶ κακία κεῖται.
ATH. Athenian: Let us indeed think about these things in this way: let us look upon each of us living beings as a divine puppet, whether constructed as their toy or with some serious purpose; for this indeed we do not know, but we do know this: that these passions in us, like cords or strings, pull us and tug against one another, being opposite, toward opposite actions, and herein lies the division between virtue and vice.