§6.488εἶεν, εἶπον·
"Very well," I said.
σκώπτεις ἐμβεβληκώς με εἰς λόγον οὕτω δυσαπόδεικτον;
"Are you mocking me after having thrust me into an argument so difficult to prove?
ἄκουε δʼ οὖν τῆς εἰκόνος, ἵνʼ ἔτι μᾶλλον ἴδῃς ὡς γλίσχρως εἰκάζω.
Listen, then, to the image, so that you may see still more how eagerly I construct images.
οὕτω γὰρ χαλεπὸν τὸ πάθος τῶν ἐπιεικεστάτων, ὃ πρὸς τὰς πόλεις πεπόνθασιν, ὥστε οὐδʼ ἔστιν ἓν οὐδὲν ἄλλο τοιοῦτον πεπονθός, ἀλλὰ δεῖ ἐκ πολλῶν αὐτὸ συναγαγεῖν εἰκάζοντα καὶ ἀπολογούμενον ὑπὲρ αὐτῶν, οἷον οἱ γραφῆς τραγελάφους καὶ τὰ τοιαῦτα μειγνύντες γράφουσιν.
For the plight of the most decent men, which they suffer in relation to the cities, is so hard that there is not any other single thing that suffers in the same way, but one must gather it from many sources in making an image and defending them, just as painters paint goat-stags and such things by mixing them together.
νόησον γὰρ τοιουτονὶ γενόμενον εἴτε πολλῶν νεῶν πέρι εἴτε μιᾶς· ναύκληρον μεγέθει μὲν καὶ ῥώμῃ ὑπὲρ τοὺς ἐν τῇ νηὶ πάντας, ὑπόκωφον δὲ καὶ ὁρῶντα ὡσαύτως βραχύ τι καὶ γιγνώσκοντα περὶ ναυτικῶν ἕτερα τοιαῦτα, τοὺς δὲ ναύτας στασιάζοντας πρὸς ἀλλήλους περὶ τῆς κυβερνήσεως, ἕκαστον οἰόμενον δεῖν κυβερνᾶν, μήτε μαθόντα πώποτε τὴν τέχνην μέτε ἔχοντα ἀποδεῖξαι διδάσκαλον ἑαυτοῦ μηδὲ χρόνον ἐν ᾧ ἐμάνθανεν, πρὸς δὲ τούτοις φάσκοντας μηδὲ διδακτὸν εἶναι, ἀλλὰ καὶ τὸν λέγοντα ὡς διδακτὸν ἑτοίμους κατατέμνειν, αὐτοὺς δὲ αὐτῷ ἀεὶ τῷ ναυκλήρῳ περικεχύσθαι δεομένους καὶ πάντα ποιοῦντας ὅπως ἂν σφίσι τὸ πηδάλιον ἐπιτρέψῃ, ἐνίοτε δʼ ἂν μὴ πείθωσιν ἀλλὰ ἄλλοι μᾶλλον, τοὺς μὲν ἄλλους ἢ ἀποκτεινύντας ἢ ἐκβάλλοντας ἐκ τῆς νεώς, τὸν δὲ γενναῖον ναύκληρον μανδραγόρᾳ ἢ μέθῃ ἤ τινι ἄλλῳ συμποδίσαντας τῆς νεὼς ἄρχειν χρωμένους τοῖς ἐνοῦσι, καὶ πίνοντάς τε καὶ εὐωχουμένους πλεῖν ὡς τὸ εἰκὸς τοὺς τοιούτους, πρὸς δὲ τούτοις ἐπαινοῦντας ναυτικὸν μὲν καλοῦντας καὶ κυβερνητικὸν καὶ ἐπιστάμενον τὰ κατὰ ναῦν, ὃς ἂν συλλαμβάνειν δεινὸς ᾖ ὅπως ἄρξουσιν ἢ πείθοντες ἢ βιαζόμενοι τὸν ναύκληρον, τὸν δὲ μὴ τοιοῦτον ψέγοντας ὡς ἄχρηστον, τοῦ δὲ ἀληθινοῦ κυβερνήτου πέρι μηδʼ ἐπαΐοντες, ὅτι ἀνάγκη αὐτῷ τὴν ἐπιμέλειαν ποιεῖσθαι ἐνιαυτοῦ καὶ ὡρῶν καὶ οὐρανοῦ καὶ ἄστρων καὶ πνευμάτων καὶ πάντων τῶν τῇ τέχνῃ προσηκόντων, εἰ μέλλει τῷ ὄντι νεὼς ἀρχικὸς ἔσεσθαι, ὅπως δὲ κυβερνήσει ἐάντε τινες βούλωνται ἐάντε μή, μήτε τέχνην τούτου μήτε μελέτην οἰόμενοι δυνατὸν εἶναι λαβεῖν ἅμα καὶ τὴν κυβερνητικήν.
For conceive of something like this happening either on many ships or on one: a shipowner who in size and strength surpasses everyone in the ship, but is slightly deaf and likewise short-sighted, and whose knowledge of nautical matters is similarly limited; and the sailors quarreling with one another about the steering, each thinking he ought to steer, though he has never learned the art, nor can he show who his teacher was or the time when he was learning it; and besides this, they claim that it is not even teachable, but are even ready to cut to pieces anyone who says it is teachable; and they themselves are always surrounding the shipowner himself, begging him and doing everything so that he may turn over the helm to them; and sometimes, if they do not persuade him but others do so more, they either kill the others or throw them out of the ship; and having bound the noble shipowner with mandragora or drink or some other thing, they rule the ship and use what is in it, and drinking and feasting they sail as is likely for such people; and besides this, they praise and call 'navigator' and 'helmsman' and 'one who knows ship matters' anyone who is clever at helping them to rule, either by persuading or forcing the shipowner, while they blame the one who is not like this as useless; and about the true captain they do not even understand that it is necessary for him to make a study of the year, the seasons, the sky, the stars, the winds, and all the things belonging to the art, if he is really to be qualified to rule a ship; and as to how he will steer, whether some wish it or not, they do not think it possible to acquire the art and practice of this along with the art of navigation.
§6.489τοιούτων δὴ περὶ τὰς ναῦς γιγνομένων τὸν ὡς ἀληθῶς κυβερνητικὸν οὐχ ἡγῇ ἂν τῷ ὄντι μετεωροσκόπον τε καὶ ἀδολέσχην καὶ ἄχρηστόν σφισι καλεῖσθαι ὑπὸ τῶν ἐν ταῖς οὕτω κατεσκευασμέναις ναυσὶ πλωτήρων; καὶ μάλα, ἔφη ὁ Ἀδείμαντος.
With such things happening on ships, do you not think that the one who is truly qualified to steer would indeed be called a star-gazer and a babbler and useless to them by the sailors in ships so equipped?" "Very much so," Adeimantus said.
οὐ δή, ἦν δʼ ἐγώ, οἶμαι δεῖσθαί σε ἐξεταζομένην τὴν εἰκόνα ἰδεῖν, ὅτι ταῖς πόλεσι πρὸς τοὺς ἀληθινοὺς φιλοσόφους τὴν διάθεσιν ἔοικεν, ἀλλὰ μανθάνειν ὃ λέγω. καὶ μάλʼ, ἔφη.
"I do not think, then," I said, "that you need to see the image examined in detail to see that it resembles the disposition of cities toward the true philosophers, but that you understand what I mean." "Very much so," he said.
πρῶτον μὲν τοίνυν ἐκεῖνον τὸν θαυμάζοντα ὅτι οἱ φιλόσοφοι οὐ τιμῶνται ἐν ταῖς πόλεσι δίδασκέ τε τὴν εἰκόνα καὶ πειρῶ πείθειν ὅτι πολὺ ἂν θαυμαστότερον ἦν εἰ ἐτιμῶντο. ἀλλὰ διδάξω, ἔφη.
"First, then, teach this image to that man who wonders that philosophers are not honored in cities, and try to persuade him that it would be much more wonderful if they were honored." "I will teach him," he said.
καὶ ὅτι τοίνυν τἀληθῆ λέγεις, ὡς ἄχρηστοι τοῖς πολλοῖς οἱ ἐπιεικέστατοι τῶν ἐν φιλοσοφίᾳ· τῆς μέντοι ἀχρηστίας τοὺς μὴ χρωμένους κέλευε αἰτιᾶσθαι, ἀλλὰ μὴ τοὺς ἐπιεικεῖς.
"And teach him also that you speak the truth when you say that the most decent of those in philosophy are useless to the many; but tell him to blame those who do not use them for this uselessness, and not the decent ones.
οὐ γὰρ ἔχει φύσιν κυβερνήτην ναυτῶν δεῖσθαι ἄρχεσθαι ὑφʼ αὑτοῦ οὐδὲ τοὺς σοφοὺς ἐπὶ τὰς τῶν πλουσίων θύρας ἰέναι, ἀλλʼ ὁ τοῦτο κομψευσάμενος ἐψεύσατο, τὸ δὲ ἀληθὲς πέφυκεν, ἐάντε πλούσιος ἐάντε πένης κάμνῃ, ἀναγκαῖον εἶναι ἐπὶ ἰατρῶν θύρας ἰέναι καὶ πάντα τὸν ἄρχεσθαι δεόμενον ἐπὶ τὰς τοῦ ἄρχειν δυναμένου, οὐ τὸν ἄρχοντα δεῖσθαι τῶν ἀρχομένων ἄρχεσθαι, οὗ ἂν τῇ ἀληθείᾳ τι ὄφελος ᾖ.
For it is not natural for a captain to beg sailors to be ruled by him, nor for the wise to go to the doors of the rich, but the one who made that clever joke lied; the truth by nature is that, whether a rich man or a poor man is sick, it is necessary to go to the doors of physicians, and everyone who needs to be ruled must go to the doors of the one capable of ruling, not the ruler begging the subjects to be ruled, if he is of any true use.
ἀλλὰ τοὺς νῦν πολιτικοὺς ἄρχοντας ἀπεικάζων οἷς ἄρτι ἐλέγομεν ναύταις οὐχ ἁμαρτήσῃ, καὶ τοὺς ὑπὸ τούτων ἀχρήστους λεγομένους καὶ μετεωρολέσχας τοῖς ὡς ἀληθῶς κυβερνήταις. ὀρθότατα, ἔφη.
But you will not go wrong in comparing the present political rulers to the sailors we just spoke of, and those called useless and star-gazing babblers by them to the true captains." "Most correct," he said.
ἔκ τε τοίνυν τούτων καὶ ἐν τούτοις οὐ ῥᾴδιον εὐδοκιμεῖν τὸ βέλτιστον ἐπιτήδευμα ὑπὸ τῶν τἀναντία ἐπιτηδευόντων· πολὺ δὲ μεγίστη καὶ ἰσχυροτάτη διαβολὴ γίγνεται φιλοσοφίᾳ διὰ τοὺς τὰ τοιαῦτα φάσκοντας ἐπιτηδεύειν, οὓς δὴ σὺ φῂς τὸν ἐγκαλοῦντα τῇ φιλοσοφίᾳ λέγειν ὡς παμπόνηροι οἱ πλεῖστοι τῶν ἰόντων ἐπʼ αὐτήν, οἱ δὲ ἐπιεικέστατοι ἄχρηστοι, καὶ ἐγὼ συνεχώρησα ἀληθῆ σε λέγειν.
"For these reasons, then, and in these circumstances, it is not easy for the best pursuit to be well-esteemed by those who pursue the opposite; but by far the greatest and most powerful slander comes to philosophy because of those who claim to pursue such things—whom you say the accuser of philosophy refers to when he says that most of those who go to it are utterly depraved, and the most decent are useless, and I agreed that you spoke the truth.
ἦ γάρ; ναί. οὐκοῦν τῆς μὲν τῶν ἐπιεικῶν ἀχρηστίας τὴν αἰτίαν διεληλύθαμεν; καὶ μάλα. τῆς δὲ τῶν πολλῶν πονηρίας τὴν ἀνάγκην βούλει τὸ μετὰ τοῦτο διέλθωμεν, καὶ ὅτι οὐδὲ τούτου φιλοσοφία αἰτία, ἂν δυνώμεθα, πειραθῶμεν δεῖξαι; πάνυ μὲν οὖν.
Is that not so?" "Yes." "Have we not, then, gone through the cause of the uselessness of the decent?" "Very much so." "Do you wish, then, next, that we go through the necessity of the depravity of the many, and that we try to show, if we can, that philosophy is not responsible for this either?" "By all means."