§410ΚΛΕΙ. ὅτε δὴ ἐνταῦθα ἦμεν τοῦ λόγου ἀποροῦντες, οἱ παρόντες ἱκανοὶ ἦσαν ἐπιπλήττειν τε αὐτῷ καὶ λέγειν ὅτι περιδεδράμηκεν εἰς ταὐτὸν ὁ λόγος τοῖς πρώτοις, καὶ ἔλεγον ὅτι
καὶ ἡ ἰατρικὴ ὁμόνοιά τίς ἐστι καὶ ἅπασαι αἱ τέχναι, καὶ περὶ ὅτου εἰσὶν ἔχουσι λέγειν· τὴν δὲ ὑπὸ σοῦ λεγομένην δικαιοσύνην ἢ ὁμόνοιαν, ὅποι τείνουσά ἐστιν, διαπέφευγεν, καὶ ἄδηλον αὐτῆς ὅτι ποτʼ ἔστιν τὸ ἔργον. ταῦτα, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἐγὼ τελευτῶν καὶ σὲ αὐτὸν ἠρώτων, καὶ εἶπές μοι δικαιοσύνης εἶναι τοὺς μὲν ἐχθροὺς βλάπτειν, τοὺς δὲ φίλους εὖ ποιεῖν.
Cleitophon: When we were at this point of the argument and in difficulties, those present were sufficient to rebuke him and to say that the argument had run around in a circle to the same point as the first ones, and they said: "Medicine too is a certain concord, and so are all the arts, and they are able to say what they are about; but as for the justice or concord spoken of by you, whither it tends has escaped us, and its product is unclear as to what it is." In the end, Socrates, I asked you yourself these very things, and you told me that it belonged to justice to harm enemies and to do good to friends.
ὕστερον δὲ ἐφάνη βλάπτειν γε οὐδέποτε ὁ δίκαιος οὐδένα· πάντα γὰρ ἐπʼ ὠφελίᾳ πάντας δρᾶν.
But later it appeared that the just man never harms anyone, for he does all things to benefit all.
ταῦτα δὲ οὐχ ἅπαξ οὐδὲ δὶς ἀλλὰ πολὺν δὴ ὑπομείνας χρόνον λιπαρῶν ἀπείρηκα, νομίσας σε τὸ μὲν προτρέπειν εἰς ἀρετῆς ἐπιμέλειαν κάλλιστʼ ἀνθρώπων δρᾶν, δυοῖν δὲ θάτερον, ἢ τοσοῦτον μόνον δύνασθαι, μακρότερον δὲ οὐδέν, ὃ γένοιτʼ ἂν καὶ περὶ ἄλλην ἡντιναοῦν τέχνην, οἷον μὴ ὄντα κυβερνήτην καταμελετῆσαι τὸν ἔπαινον περὶ αὐτῆς, ὡς πολλοῦ τοῖς ἀνθρώποις ἀξία, καὶ περὶ τῶν ἄλλων τεχνῶν ὡσαύτως· ταὐτὸν δὴ καὶ σοί τις ἐπενέγκοι τάχʼ ἂν περὶ δικαιοσύνης, ὡς οὐ μᾶλλον ὄντι δικαιοσύνης ἐπιστήμονι, διότι καλῶς αὐτὴν ἐγκωμιάζεις.
Having endured this not once or twice but for a long time, importuning you, I have given up, concluding that on the one hand, you do the work of exhorting to the care of virtue most beautifully of all men, but on the other hand, one of two things must be: either you are capable only of this much and nothing further—which might happen also in the case of any other art whatsoever, as when someone who is not a helmsman practices the praise of helmsmanship, showing how highly valuable it is to men, and likewise for other arts; and someone might bring the same charge against you regarding justice, that you are no more an expert in justice just because you praise it beautifully.
οὐ μὴν τό γε ἐμὸν οὕτως ἔχει· δυοῖν δὲ θάτερον, ἢ οὐκ εἰδέναι σε ἢ οὐκ ἐθέλειν αὐτῆς ἐμοὶ κοινωνεῖν.
However, my own view is not so; but rather one of two things: either you do not know it, or you do not wish to share it with me.
διὰ ταῦτα δὴ καὶ πρὸς Θρασύμαχον οἶμαι πορεύσομαι καὶ ἄλλοσε ὅποι δύναμαι, ἀπορῶν· ἐπεὶ εἴ γʼ ἐθέλεις σὺ τούτων μὲν ἤδη παύσασθαι πρὸς ἐμὲ τῶν λόγων τῶν προτρεπτικῶν, οἷον δέ, εἰ περὶ γυμναστικῆς προτετραμμένος ἦ τοῦ σώματος δεῖν μὴ ἀμελεῖν, τὸ ἐφεξῆς ἂν τῷ προτρεπτικῷ λόγῳ ἔλεγες οἷον τὸ σῶμά μου φύσει ὂν οἵας θεραπείας δεῖται, καὶ νῦν δὴ ταὐτὸν γιγνέσθω.
For this reason, in my perplexity, I think I will go to Thrasymachus and elsewhere, wherever I can; since if you are willing now at last to cease these exhorting speeches to me, and instead—just as, if you had exhorted me about gymnastics that I must not neglect my body, you would have told me next, following the exhortation, what kind of care my body needs according to its nature—let the same happen now.
θὲς τὸν Κλειτοφῶντα ὁμολογοῦντα ὡς ἔστιν καταγέλαστον τῶν μὲν ἄλλων ἐπιμέλειαν ποιεῖσθαι, ψυχῆς δέ, ἧς ἕνεκα τἆλλα διαπονούμεθα, ταύτης ἠμεληκέναι· καὶ τἆλλα πάντα οἴου με νῦν οὕτως εἰρηκέναι τὰ τούτοις ἑξῆς, ἃ καὶ νυνδὴ διῆλθον.
Assume that Cleitophon agrees that it is ridiculous to care for other things while neglecting the soul, for the sake of which we labor at all other things; and assume that I have now spoken all other things next in order to these, which indeed I have just run through.
καί σου δεόμενος λέγω μηδαμῶς ἄλλως ποιεῖν, ἵνα μή, καθάπερ νῦν, τὰ μὲν ἐπαινῶ σε πρὸς Λυσίαν καὶ πρὸς τοὺς ἄλλους, τὰ δέ τι καὶ ψέγω.
And I beg of you not to do otherwise, so that I may not, as I do now, praise you in some respects to Lysias and the others, but in some other respects also blame you.
μὴ μὲν γὰρ προτετραμμένῳ σε ἀνθρώπῳ, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἄξιον εἶναι τοῦ παντὸς φήσω, προτετραμμένῳ δὲ σχεδὸν καὶ ἐμπόδιον τοῦ πρὸς τέλος ἀρετῆς ἐλθόντα εὐδαίμονα γενέσθαι.
For to a man who has not yet been exhorted, Socrates, I will say that you are worth everything, but to one who has already been exhorted, you are almost a hindrance to reaching the end of virtue and becoming happy.