§168φόβον δὲ ἤδη τινὰ κατανενόηκας, ὃς ἑαυτὸν μὲν καὶ τοὺς ἄλλους φόβους φοβεῖται, τῶν δεινῶν δʼ οὐδὲ ἓν φοβεῖται; οὐ κατανενόηκα, ἔφη.
"And have you ever yet noticed any fear which fears itself and the other fears, but fears not even one of the things that are terrible?" "I have not," he said.
δόξαν δὲ δοξῶν δόξαν καὶ αὑτῆς, ὧν δὲ αἱ ἄλλαι δοξάζουσιν μηδὲν δοξάζουσαν; οὐδαμῶς. ἀλλʼ ἐπιστήμην, ὡς ἔοικεν, φαμέν τινα εἶναι τοιαύτην, ἥτις μαθήματος μὲν οὐδενός ἐστιν ἐπιστήμη, αὑτῆς δὲ καὶ τῶν ἄλλων ἐπιστημῶν ἐπιστήμη; φαμὲν γάρ. οὐκοῦν ἄτοπον, εἰ ἄρα καὶ ἔστιν;
"And an opinion which is an opinion of opinions and of itself, but opines nothing of what the other opinions opine?" "By no means." "But a knowledge, as it seems, we say is some such thing, which is a knowledge of no subject of learning, but is a knowledge of itself and of the other knowledges?" "Yes, for we say so." "Is it not strange, then, if indeed it actually exists?
μηδὲν γάρ πω διισχυριζώμεθα ὡς οὐκ ἔστιν, ἀλλʼ εἰ ἔστιν ἔτι σκοπῶμεν. ὀρθῶς λέγεις. φέρε δή· ἔστι μὲν αὕτη ἡ ἐπιστήμη τινὸς ἐπιστήμη, καὶ ἔχει τινὰ τοιαύτην δύναμιν ὥστε τινὸς εἶναι· ἦ γάρ; πάνυ γε.
For let us not yet assert strongly that it does not exist, but let us still consider if it does." "You say well." "Come then: this knowledge is knowledge of something, and has some such power as to be of something; is it not so?" "Certainly." "And indeed we say that the greater has some such power as to be greater than something?
καὶ γὰρ τὸ μεῖζόν φαμεν τοιαύτην τινὰ ἔχειν δύναμιν, ὥστε τινὸς εἶναι μεῖζον; ἔχει γάρ. οὐκοῦν ἐλάττονός τινος, εἴπερ ἔσται μεῖζον. ἀνάγκη. εἰ οὖν τι εὕροιμεν μεῖζον, ὃ τῶν μὲν μειζόνων ἐστὶν μεῖζον καὶ ἑαυτοῦ, ὧν δὲ τἆλλα μείζω ἐστὶν μηδενὸς μεῖζον, πάντως ἄν που ἐκεῖνό γʼ αὐτῷ ὑπάρχοι, εἴπερ ἑαυτοῦ μεῖζον εἴη, καὶ ἔλαττον ἑαυτοῦ εἶναι· ἢ οὔ; πολλὴ ἀνάγκη, ἔφη, ὦ Σώκρατες.
For it has." "Then it is greater than something smaller, if indeed it is to be greater." "Necessarily." "If then we should find something greater, which is greater than the greater things and itself, but greater than none of the things than which the others are greater, surely that at least would belong to it, if indeed it were greater than itself, to be also smaller than itself; or not?" "It is a great necessity, Socrates," he said.
οὐκοῦν καὶ εἴ τι διπλάσιόν ἐστιν τῶν τε ἄλλων διπλασίων καὶ ἑαυτοῦ, ἡμίσεος δήπου ὄντος ἑαυτοῦ τε καὶ τῶν ἄλλων διπλάσιον ἂν εἴη· οὐ γάρ ἐστίν που ἄλλου διπλάσιον ἢ ἡμίσεος. ἀληθῆ. πλέον δὲ αὑτοῦ ὂν οὐ καὶ ἔλαττον ἔσται, καὶ βαρύτερον ὂν κουφότερον, καὶ πρεσβύτερον ὂν νεώτερον, καὶ τἆλλα πάντα ὡσαύτως, ὅτιπερ ἂν τὴν ἑαυτοῦ δύναμιν πρὸς ἑαυτὸ ἔχῃ, οὐ καὶ ἐκείνην ἕξει τὴν οὐσίαν, πρὸς ἣν ἡ δύναμις αὐτοῦ ἦν; λέγω δὲ τὸ τοιόνδε· οἷον ἡ ἀκοή, φαμέν, οὐκ ἄλλου τινὸς ἦν ἀκοὴ ἢ φωνῆς· ἦ γάρ; ναί. οὐκοῦν εἴπερ αὐτὴ αὑτῆς ἀκούσεται, φωνὴν ἐχούσης ἑαυτῆς ἀκούσεται· οὐ γὰρ ἂν ἄλλως ἀκούσειεν. πολλὴ ἀνάγκη. καὶ ἡ ὄψις γέ που, ὦ ἄριστε, εἴπερ ὄψεται αὐτὴ ἑαυτήν, χρῶμά τι αὐτὴν ἀνάγκη ἔχειν· ἄχρων γὰρ ὄψις οὐδὲν μή ποτε ἴδῃ. οὐ γὰρ οὖν. ὁρᾷς οὖν, ὦ Κριτία, ὅτι ὅσα διεληλύθαμεν, τὰ μὲν αὐτῶν ἀδύνατα παντάπασι φαίνεται ἡμῖν, τὰ δʼ ἀπιστεῖται σφόδρα μή ποτʼ ἂν τὴν ἑαυτῶν δύναμιν πρὸς ἑαυτὰ σχεῖν;
"Then also if something is double of the other doubles and of itself, it would surely be double of itself and of the others, as they are half; for it is surely double of nothing else than a half." "True." "And being more than itself, will it not also be less, and being heavier, lighter, and being older, younger, and all other things likewise: whatever has its own power toward itself, will it not also have that essence toward which its power was directed?" "I mean something like this: for instance, hearing, we say, was hearing of nothing else than sound; was it not?" "Yes." "Then if indeed it is to hear itself, it will hear itself as having a voice; for it could not hear otherwise." "Necessarily." "And sight too, surely, my excellent friend, if indeed it is to see itself, must have some color; for a colorless sight can never see anything." "Certainly not." "Do you see then, Critias, that of all the things we have gone through, some of them seem to us altogether impossible, while others are strongly doubted as to whether they could ever have their own power toward themselves?
μεγέθη μὲν γὰρ καὶ πλήθη καὶ τὰ τοιαῦτα παντάπασιν ἀδύνατον· ἢ οὐχί; πάνυ γε.
For as to magnitudes and multitudes and such things, it is altogether impossible; or is it not?" "Certainly."