§142ΣΩ. ὁρᾷς δὴ καὶ τῶν ἡμετέρων πολιτῶν—ταῦτα γὰρ οὐκ ἄλλων ἀκηκόαμεν, ἀλλʼ αὐτοὶ παρόντες οἴδαμεν— ὅσοι στρατηγίας ἐπιθυμήσαντες ἤδη καὶ τυχόντες αὐτῆς οἱ μὲν ἔτι καὶ νῦν φυγάδες τῆσδε τῆς πόλεώς εἰσιν, οἱ δὲ τὸν βίον ἐτελεύτησαν·
SOCRATES: Indeed, you see also among our citizens—for these are things we have not heard from others, but know ourselves by being present— how many, having desired the office of general and having obtained it, some are even now exiles from this city, and others have ended their lives.
οἱ δὲ ἄριστα δοκοῦντες αὐτῶν πράττειν διὰ πολλῶν κινδύνων ἐλθόντες καὶ φόβων οὐ μόνον ἐν ταύτῃ τῇ στρατηγίᾳ, ἀλλʼ ἐπεὶ εἰς τὴν ἑαυτῶν κατῆλθον, ὑπὸ τῶν συκοφαντῶν πολιορκούμενοι πολιορκίαν οὐδὲν ἐλάττω τῆς ὑπὸ τῶν πολεμίων διετέλεσαν, ὥστε ἐνίους αὐτῶν εὔχεσθαι ἀστρατηγήτους εἶναι μᾶλλον ἢ ἐστρατηγηκέναι.
And those who seem to fare best among them, having gone through many dangers and fears not only during this generalship, but after they returned to their own land, continually being besieged by sycophants with a siege no less than that by enemies, so that some of them prayed rather to have been without office than to have been generals.
εἰ μὲν οὖν ἦσαν οἱ κίνδυνοί τε καὶ πόνοι φέροντες εἰς ὠφέλειαν, εἶχεν ἄν τινα λόγον· νῦν δὲ καὶ πολὺ τοὐναντίον.
If, then, the dangers and labors led to some benefit, it would have some reason; but now, it is quite the opposite.
εὑρήσεις δὲ καὶ περὶ τέκνων τὸν αὐτὸν τρόπον, εὐξαμένους τινὰς ἤδη γενέσθαι καὶ γενομένων εἰς συμφοράς τε καὶ λύπας τὰς μεγίστας καταστάντας.
And you will find the same thing in the case of children as well, that some, having prayed that they might have them, when they were born, fell into the greatest misfortunes and griefs.
οἱ μὲν γὰρ μοχθηρῶν διὰ τέλους ὄντων τῶν τέκνων ὅλον τὸν βίον λυπούμενοι διήγαγον· τοὺς δὲ χρηστῶν μὲν γενομένων, συμφοραῖς δὲ χρησαμένων ὥστε στερηθῆναι, καὶ τούτους οὐδὲν εἰς ἐλάττονας δυστυχίας καθεστηκότας ἤπερ ἐκείνους καὶ βουλομένους ἂν ἀγένητα μᾶλλον εἶναι ἢ γενέσθαι.
For some, because their children were wretched to the end, spent their whole life grieving; while others, whose children had indeed been good, but met with misfortunes so as to be deprived of them, these too were established in no less misfortunes than the former, and would have wished rather that they had not been born than that they had.
ἀλλʼ ὅμως τούτων τε καὶ ἑτέρων πολλῶν ὁμοιοτρόπων τούτοις οὕτω σφόδρα καταδήλων ὄντων, σπάνιον εὑρεῖν ὅστις ἂν ἢ διδομένων ἀπόσχοιτο ἢ μέλλων διʼ εὐχῆς τεύξεσθαι παύσαιτο ἂν εὐχόμενος·
Nevertheless, although these things and many others of the same kind are so very manifest, it is rare to find anyone who would either abstain from what is given, or, when about to obtain something through prayer, would cease praying.
οἱ δὲ πολλοὶ οὔτε ἂν τυραννίδος διδομένης ἀπόσχοιντο ἂν οὔτε στρατηγίας οὐδʼ ἑτέρων πολλῶν, ἃ παρόντα βλάπτει μᾶλλον ἢ ὠφελεῖ, ἀλλὰ κἂν εὔξαιντο ἂν γενέσθαι, εἴ τῳ μὴ παρόντα τυγχάνει· ὀλίγον δὲ ἐπισχόντες ἐνίοτε παλινῳδοῦσιν, ἀνευχόμενοι ἅττʼ ἂν τὸ πρῶτον εὔξωνται.
And the many would neither abstain from tyranny if offered, nor from generalship, nor from many other things which, when present, harm rather than benefit, but would even pray for them to happen, if they do not happen to be present to anyone; but after waiting a little, they sometimes sing a different tune, praying away what they prayed for at first.
ἐγὼ μὲν οὖν ἀπορῶ μὴ ὡς ἀληθῶς μάτην θεοὺς ἄνθρωποι αἰτιῶνται, ἐξ ἐκείνων φάμενοι κακά σφισιν εἶναι· "οἱ δὲ καὶ αὐτοὶ σφῇσιν"
εἴτε
"ἀτασθαλίαισιν"
εἴτε ἀφροσύναις χρὴ εἰπεῖν,
"ὑπὲρ μόρον"
"ἄλγεʼ ἔχουσι"
. κινδυνεύει γοῦν, ὦ Ἀλκιβιάδη, φρόνιμός τις εἶναι ἐκεῖνος ὁ ποιητής, ὃς δοκεῖ μοι φίλοις ἀνοήτοις τισὶ χρησάμενος, ὁρῶν αὐτοὺς καὶ πράττοντας καὶ εὐχομένους ἅπερ οὐ βέλτιον ἦν, ἐκείνοις δὲ ἐδόκει, κοινῇ ὑπὲρ ἁπάντων αὐτῶν εὐχὴν ποιήσασθαι· λέγει δέ πως ὡδί—
"
Ζεῦ βασιλεῦ, τὰ μὲν ἐσθλά, φησί, καὶ εὐχομένοις
καὶ ἀνεύκτοις
ἄμμι δίδου, τὰ δὲ δειλὰ καὶ εὐχομένοις ἀπαλέξειν
"
κελεύει.
I, for my part, wonder if it is not indeed in vain that men blame the gods, saying that evils come to them from those, whereas "they themselves, by their own" either "recklessness" or "folly", as one should call it, "beyond fate" "have sorrows." At any rate, Alkibiades, that poet seems to be a wise man, who, I think, having associated with some foolish friends, and seeing them both doing and praying for things that were not better for them, though they seemed so to them, made a prayer in common for all of them; and he speaks somehow thus: "King Zeus, give to us what is good, whether we pray for it or do not pray for it, but command him to ward off what is harmful, even if we pray for it."