§18AUG. dixit: Memento, quod apostolus dixerit conuersatione nos alienatos a deo esse. FORT. dixit: Trado ego duas substantias fuisse: in lucis substantia haberi deum, ut superius diximus, incorruptibilem: fuisse uero contrariam naturam tenebrarum.
Aug. said: "Remember that the Apostle said we were alienated from God by our conduct." Fort. said: "I maintain that there were two substances: that God, as we said above, was held to be in the substance of light, being incorruptible; but that there was a contrary nature of darkness.
eam uirtute dei uinci hodieque confiteor, et ad meum regressum saluatorem esse Christum emissum, ut ante idem apostolus ait. §19AUG. dixit: Rationibus ut discuteremus duarum naturarum fidem, interpositum est ab his, qui nos audiunt.
I confess even today that it is being conquered by the power of God, and that for my return Christ was sent as Savior, as the same Apostle said before." Aug. said: "That we should discuss the faith of the two natures by reasons was requested by those who hear us.
sed quoniam ad scripturas iterum confugisti, ad eas ego descendo ac nihil praetermittendum esse postulo, ne quibusdam capitibus utentes nebulas adferamus eis, quibus notae scripturae non sunt.
But since you have fled again to the Scriptures, I descend to them, and I demand that nothing be omitted, lest by using certain chapters we bring mists upon those to whom the Scriptures are not known.
a capite igitur quod habet apostolus Paulus in epistula sua ad Romanos consideremus.
Let us therefore consider from the beginning which the Apostle Paul has in his Epistle to the Romans.
in prima enim pagina est, quod uehementer contra uos est.
For on the very first page is that which is vehemently against you.
dicit enim: Paulus seruus Iesu Christi, uocatus apostolus, praedestinatus in euangelium dei. quod ante promiserat per prophetas suos in scripturis sanctis, de filio, qui factus est ei ex semine Dauid secundum carnem, qui praedestinatus est filius dei in uirtute secundum spiritum sanctificationis ex resurrectione mortuorum Iesu Christi domini nostri. uidemus apostolum de domino nostro\' nos docere, ut et uirtute dei ante carnem praedestinatus fuerit et secundum carnem factus sit ei de semine Dauid.
For he says: 'Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God, which he had promised before through his prophets in the holy Scriptures, concerning his Son, who was made to him of the seed of David according to the flesh, who was predestined Son of God in power according to the Spirit of holiness by the resurrection from the dead, Jesus Christ our Lord.' We see that the Apostle teaches us concerning our Lord, that he was both predestined by the power of God before the flesh and made to him of the seed of David according to the flesh.
hoc uos cum semper negaueritis et negetis, quomodo scripturas flagitatis, ut secundum eas potius disseramus?
FORT. dixit: Secundum carnem adseritis ex semine Dauid, cum praedicetur ex uirgine esse natus, et filius dei magnificetur.
Since you have always denied and still deny this, how do you demand the Scriptures, that we should rather dispute according to them? "Fort. said: "You assert 'according to the flesh from the seed of David,' when he is preached to have been born of a virgin, and is magnified as the Son of God.
fieri enim non potest, nisi ut quod de spiritu est, spiritus habeatur, et quod de carne est, caro intellegatur.
For it cannot be, unless that which is of the spirit is held to be spirit, and that which is of the flesh is understood to be flesh.
contra quod est ipsa auctoritas euangelii, qua dicitur, quod caro et sanguis regnum dei possidere non possunt, nec corruptio incorruptelam possidebit. Hic strepitus factus est a consedentibus, qui rationibus potius agi uolebant, quia uidebant eum non omnia, quae in apostoli codice scripta sunt, uelle accipere.
Against which is the very authority of the Gospel, by which it is said, that flesh and blood cannot possess the kingdom of God, nor shall corruption possess incorruption." Here a noise was made by those sitting together, who wished the matter to be conducted rather by reasons, because they saw that he did not wish to accept everything that is written in the codex of the Apostle.
deinde passim sermocinatio ab omnibus haberi coepit, quousque diceret sermonem dei ligatum esse in gente tenebrarum.
Then everywhere a conversation began to be held by all, until he said that the Word of God was bound in the nation of darkness.
quod cum exhorruissent qui aderant, discessum est.
When those who were present had shuddered at this, they departed.
Postera die adhibito iterum notario res acta sic est.
On the next day, a stenographer being employed again, the business was conducted thus.
FORT. dixit: Dico, quod nihil mali ex se proferat omnipotens deus et quod quae sua sunt incorrupta maneant uno ex fonte inuiolabili orta et genita; cetera uero, quae in hoc mundo uersantur contraria, non ex deo manare nec principe deo paruisse in hoc saeculo, id est quod non ex ipso originem trahant.
Fort. said: "I say that almighty God brings forth nothing of evil from Himself, and that what are His remain incorrupt, arisen and begotten from one inviolable source; but that other things which are turned contrariwise in this world do not flow from God, nor have they obeyed God as ruler in this world, that is, they do not draw their origin from Him.
haec ergo in fide suscepimus, quod aliena sint mala a deo.
These things therefore we have received in faith, that evils are alien from God."