§12καθάπερ καὶ οἱ τὸ ἓν καὶ τὴν ἀόριστον δυάδα ποιοῦντες.
Just as also those who posit the One and the indefinite dyad [do].
τοὺς γὰρ ἀριθμοὺς γεννήσαντες καὶ τὰ ἐπίπεδα καὶ τὰ σώματα σχεδὸν τἆλλα παραλείπουσι πλὴν ὅσον ἐφαπτόμενοι καὶ τοσοῦτο μόνον δηλοῦντες ὅτι τὰ μὲν ἀπὸ τῆς ἀορίστου δυάδος οἷον τόπος καὶ κενὸν καὶ ἄπειρον, τὰ δ᾽ ἀπὸ τῶν ἀριθμῶν καὶ τοῦ ἑνὸς οἷον ψυχὴ καὶ ἄλλ᾽ ἄττα, χρόνον δ᾽ἅμα καὶ οὐρανὸν καὶ ἕτερα δὴ πλείω· τοῦ δ᾽ οὐρανοῦ πέρι καὶ τῶν λοιπῶν οὐδεμίαν ἔτι ποιοῦνται μνείαν.
For after generating numbers, planes, and solids, they omit almost everything else, except in so far as they touch upon them, and indicate only this much: that some things, such as place, void, and the infinite, derive from the indefinite dyad, while others, such as soul and certain other things, derive from numbers and the One, and at the same time time and heaven and indeed many other things; but concerning the heaven and the rest they make no further mention.
ὡσαύτως δ᾽ οὐδὲ οἱ περὶ Σπεύσιππον οὐδὲ τῶν ἄλλων οὐθεὶς πλὴν Ξενοκράτης· οὗτος γὰρ ἀπόντα πως περιτίθησι περὶ τὸν κόσμον ὁμοίως αἰσθητὰ καὶ νοητὰ καὶ μαθηματικὰ καὶ ἔτι δὴ τὰ θεῖα. §13πειρᾶται δὲ καὶ Ἑστιαῖος μέχρι τινὸς, οὐχ ὥσπερ εἴρηται περὶ τῶν πρώτων μόνον.
Likewise neither those around Speusippus nor any of the others [do so], except Xenocrates; for he somehow assigns the things that are absent to the world, likewise sensible, intelligible, mathematical, and indeed also divine things. And Hestiaeus too makes an attempt up to a certain point, not only concerning the first principles, as has been said.
Πλάτων μὲν οὖν ἐν τῷ ἀνάγειν εἰς τὰς ἀρχὰς δόξειεν ἄν ἅπτεσθαι τῶν ἄλλων εἰς τὰς ἰδέας ἀνάπτων, ταύτας δ᾽ εἰς τοὺς ἀριθμοὺς, ἐκ δὲ τούτων εἰς τὰς ἀρχὰς, εἶτα κατὰ τὴν γένεσιν μέχρι τῶν εἰρημένων.
Plato, then, in reducing things to the principles, would seem to touch upon the other things by connecting them to the ideas, and these to numbers, and from these to the principles, and then, in accordance with generation, [proceeding] as far as the aforementioned things.
οἱ δὲ τῶν ἀρχῶν μόνον.
But the others [treat] of the principles alone.
ἔνιοι δὲ καὶ τὴν ἀλήθειαν ἐν τούτοις· τὰ γὰρ ὄντα μόνον περὶ τὰς ἀρχάς.
And some even [place] the truth in these; for [they say] that beings are only around the principles.
συμβαίνει δὲ τοὐναντίον ἢ ἐν ταῖς ἄλλαις μεθόδοις· ἐν ἐκείνοις γὰρ τὰ μετὰ τὰς ἀρχὰς ἰσχυρότερα καὶ οἷον τελεώτερα τῶν ἐπιστημῶν·
But the contrary happens to what occurs in the other methods (sciences); for in those, the things after the principles are stronger and, as it were, more complete among the sciences.
τάχα δὲ καὶ εὐλόγως.
And perhaps this is also reasonable.
ἔνθα μὲν γὰρ τῶν ἀρχῶν ἐν δὲ ταῖς λοιπαῖς ἀπὸ τῶν ἀρχῶν ἡ ζήτησις. §14πῶς δέ ποτε χρὴ καὶ ποίας τὰς ἀρχὰς ὑποθέσθαι τάχ᾽ ἂν ἀπορήσειέ τις, πότερον ἀμόρφους καὶ οἷον δυναμικὰς ὥσπερ ὅσοι πῦρ καὶ γῆν, ἢ μεμορφωμένας ὡς μάλιστα δέον ταύτας ὡρίσθαι καθάπερ ἐν τῷ Τιμαίῳ φησίν·
For in the one case, the inquiry is of the principles, while in the rest, the inquiry is from the principles. But how on earth and what kind of principles one should posit, one might perhaps be puzzled: whether shapeless and, as it were, potential ones, just as those who [posit] fire and earth, or shaped ones, on the ground that these ought most of all to be determined, just as he says in the Timaeus; for order and being determined are most proper to the most honorable things.
τοῖς γὰρ τιμιωτάτοις οἰκειότατον ἡ τάξις καὶ τὸ ὡρίσθαι. φαίνεται δὲ καὶ ἐν ταῖς λοιπαῖς σχεδὸν ἔχειν οὕτω καθάπερ τῇ γραμματικῇ καὶ μουσικῇ καὶ ταῖς μαθηματικαῖς.
And it seems to be so in almost all the rest too, such as grammar, music, and the mathematical sciences.
συνακολουθεῖ δὲ καὶ τὰ μετὰ τὰς ἀρχάς.
And the things after the principles also follow along.
ἔτι δὲ καὶ κατὰ τὰς τέχνας ὁμοίως αἵπερ τὴν φύσιν μιμοῦνται· καὶ τὰ ὄργανα καὶ τὰ ἄλλα κατὰ τὰς ἀρχάς.
And further, likewise in the case of the arts, which imitate nature; both the instruments and the other things conform to the principles.
οἱ μὲν οὐν ἀμόρφους πάσας, οἱ δὲ μόνον τὰς ὑλικάς· οἱ δ᾽ ἀμφοτέρας ἐμμόρφους, καὶ τὰς τῆς ὕλης, ὡς ἐν ἀμφοῖν τὸ τέλεον· §15οἷον γὰρ ἐξ ἀντικειμένων τὴν ἅπασαν οὐσίαν.
Some, then, make all [principles] shapeless, others only the material ones; and others make both shaped, even those of matter, on the ground that perfection is in both; for [they hold] as it were that the whole of reality is from opposites.
ἄλογον δὲ κἀκεῖνο δόξειεν ἂν εἰ ὁ μὲν ὅλος οὐρανὸς καὶ ἕκαστα τῶν μερῶν ἅπαντ᾽ ἐν τάξει καὶ λόγῳ καὶ μορφαῖς καὶ δυνάμεσι καὶ περιόδοις, ἐν δὲ ταῖς ἀρχαῖς μηθὲν τοιοῦτον ἀλλ᾽ ὥσπερ σάρξ εἰκῆ κεχυμένων ὁ κάλλιστος, φησὶν Ἡράκλειτος, κόσμος.
And that also would seem absurd, if the whole heaven and each of its parts are all in order and reason and shapes and powers and periods, but in the principles there is nothing of the sort, but rather, as Heraclitus says, 'the most beautiful world is like a heap of sweepings [literally, flesh] poured out at random'.
καὶ κατὰ τοὐλάχιστον δ᾽ ὡς εἰπεῖν λαμβάνουσιν ὁμοίως ἐν ἀψύχοις καὶ ἐμψύχοις. ὡρισμέναι γὰρ ἑκάστων αἱ φύσεις ὡς εἰπεῖν καίπερ αὐτομάτως γινομένων, τὰς δ᾽ ἀρχὰς ἀορίστους εἶναι.
And they assume [this] likewise, so to speak, even down to the smallest things, both in inanimate and animate things; for [it is absurd] that while the natures of individual things are, so to speak, determined, even though they come to be spontaneously, the principles should be undetermined.
χαλεπὸν δὲ πάλιν αὐτὸ τὸ τοὺς λόγους ἑκάστοις περιθεῖναι πρὸς τὸ ἕνεκά του συνάγοντας ἐν ἅπασι καὶ ἐν ζώοις καὶ φυτοῖς καὶ ἐν αὐτῇ πομφόλυγι· πλὴν εἰ συμβαίνει τῇ ἑτέρων τάξει καὶ μεταβολῇ μορφὰς παντοίας καὶ ποικιλίας γίγνεσθαι τῶν τε περὶ τὸν ἀέρα καὶ τὴν γῆν.
But on the other hand, it is difficult in itself to assign the reasons (logos) to each, bringing them together under the 'for the sake of something' in all things, both in animals and plants, and in a mere bubble itself; unless indeed it happens that, by the order and change of other things, all kinds of shapes and varieties come to be among the things around the air and the earth.
ὦν δὴ μέγιστόν τινες παράδειγμα ποιοῦνται τὰ περὶ τὰς ὥρας τὰς ἐτείους ἐν αἷς καὶ ζώων καὶ φυτῶν καὶ καρπῶν γενέσεις οἶον γεννῶντος τοῦ ἡλίου.
Of which indeed some make the greatest example the phenomena of the yearly seasons, in which the generation of animals and plants and fruits takes place, as if the sun were generating them.
καὶ ταῦτα μὲν ἐνταῦθα που ζητεῖ τὴν σκέψιν, ἀφορισμὸν ἀπαιτοῦνμέχρι πόσου τὸ τεταγμένον, καὶ διὰ τί πλέον ἀδύνατον ἢ εἰς τὸ χεῖρον μετάβασις.
And these matters somewhere here require investigation, demanding a definition of how far what is ordered extends, and why a further [extension] is impossible, or [why there is] transition to the worse.