§12.960ΑΘ. πρόθεσις δὲ καὶ τἆλλα ἔστω μὲν κατὰ τὸν περὶ τὰ τοιαῦτα νόμον γιγνόμενα, τῷ δὲ πολιτικῷ νομοθετοῦντι παραχωρεῖν χρὴ τὰ τοιάδε· δακρύειν μὲν τὸν τετελευτηκότα ἐπιτάττειν ἢ μὴ ἄμορφον, θρηνεῖν δὲ καὶ ἔξω τῆς οἰκίας φωνὴν ἐξαγγέλλειν ἀπαγορεύειν, καὶ τὸν νεκρὸν εἰς τὸ φανερὸν προάγειν τῶν ὁδῶν κωλύειν, καὶ ἐν ταῖς ὁδοῖς πορευόμενον φθέγγεσθαι, καὶ πρὸ ἡμέρας ἔξω τῆς πόλεως εἶναι.
ATH. Let the laying out of the body (prothesis) and other matters be done according to the law concerning such things, but to the political legislator it is necessary to permit the following things: to command or not proper weeping for the deceased, but to forbid wailing and uttering voices outside the house, and to prevent leading the dead into the open part of the streets, and crying out while marching in the streets, and to require being outside the city before daybreak.
ταῦτα δὴ κείσθω τε οὕτω περὶ τὰ τοιαῦτα νόμιμα, καὶ ὁ μὲν πειθόμενος ἔστω ζημίας ἐκτός, ὁ δὲ ἀπειθῶν ἑνὶ τῶν νομοφυλάκων ὑπὸ πάντων ζημιούσθω τῇ δοξάσῃ πᾶσι κοινῇ ζημίᾳ.
Let these things indeed be established thus concerning such sacred customs; and let him who obeys be free from penalty, but let him who disobeys one of the guardians of the laws be punished by all with the penalty approved by all in common.
ὅσαι δʼ ἄλλαι γίγνονται περὶ τελευτήσαντας ταφαὶ εἴτε καὶ ἄταφοι πράξεις, περὶ πατροφόνων καὶ ἱεροσύλων καὶ τῶν τοιούτων πάντων, εἰρημέναι ἐν τοῖς ἔμπροσθεν κεῖνται διὰ νόμων, ὥστε σχεδὸν ἡ νομοθεσία τέλος ἂν ἡμῖν ἔχοι·
And as for all other burials or non-burials concerning the deceased, regarding parricides, temple-robbers, and all such, these have been stated previously and established through laws, so that our legislation would almost have an end.
τῶν πάντων δʼ ἑκάστοτε τέλος οὐ τὸ δρᾶσαί τι σχεδὸν οὐδὲ τὸ κτήσασθαι κατοικίσαι τʼ ἐστίν, ἀλλὰ τῷ γεννηθέντι σωτηρίαν ἐξευρόντα τελέως ἀεί, τότʼ ἤδη νομίζειν πᾶν ὅσον δεῖ πραχθῆναι πεπρᾶχθαι, πρότερον δʼ ἀτελὲς εἶναι τὸ ὅλον.
But in all things, the end in each case is almost never the performing of something, nor the acquiring or establishing of a colony, but rather, having found a means of preservation for that which has been brought into being, completely and always, then finally to consider that everything that ought to be done has been done, whereas before this, the whole is incomplete.
ΚΛ. καλῶς, ὦ ξένε, λέγεις·
CLE.
πρὸς ὅτι δὲ τὸ νῦν αὖ ῥηθὲν εἴρηται, φράζʼ ἔτι σαφέστερον.
You speak well, Stranger; but explain still more clearly for what purpose that which has just been said was spoken.
ΑΘ. ὦ Κλεινία, πολλὰ τῶν ἔμπροσθεν καλῶς ὕμνηται, σχεδὸν δὲ οὐχ ἥκιστα τὰ τῶν Μοιρῶν προσρήματα.
ATH. O Cleinias, many of the things previously said have been beautifully praised, and almost not least the appellations of the Fates.
ΚΛ. ποῖα δή;
CLE. Which ones indeed?
ΑΘ. τὸ Λάχεσιν μὲν τὴν πρώτην εἶναι, Κλωθὼ δὲ τὴν δευτέραν, τὴν Ἄτροπον δὴ τρίτην σώτειραν τῶν λεχθέντων, ἀπῃκασμένα τῇ τῶν κλωσθέντων τῷ πυρὶ τὴν ἀμετάστροφον ἀπεργαζομένων δύναμιν· ἃ δὴ καὶ πόλει καὶ πολιτείᾳ δεῖ μὴ μόνον ὑγίειαν καὶ σωτηρίαν τοῖς σώμασι παρασκευάζειν, ἀλλὰ καὶ εὐνομίαν ἐν ταῖς ψυχαῖς, μᾶλλον δὲ σωτηρίαν τῶν νόμων.
ATH. That Lachesis is the first, Clotho the second, and Atropos indeed the third, the preserver of what has been spoken, likened to the power of things spun which, by means of fire, produces the irreversible strength; which indeed must provide not only health and preservation for the bodies in a city and constitution, but also order in the souls, or rather, the preservation of the laws.
ἡμῖν δʼ ἔτι μοι φαίνεσθαι δοκεῖ τοῦτʼ ἐλλεῖπον τοῖς νόμοις εἶναι, πῶς χρὴ τὴν ἀμετάστροφον αὐτοῖς ἐγγίγνεσθαι κατὰ φύσιν δύναμιν.
But to me, this still seems to be lacking in our laws: how the irreversible power is to be naturally implanted in them.
ΚΛ. οὐ σμικρὸν λέγεις, εἴπερ ἐστὶ μὴ δυνατὸν εὑρεῖν ὅπῃ γίγνοιτʼ ἂν παντὶ κτῆμά τι τοιοῦτον.
CLE. You do not speak of a small thing, if indeed it is impossible to find in what way such a possession would come to be in everything.
ΑΘ. ἀλλʼ ἔστι μὴν δυνατόν, ὥς γέ μοι τὰ νῦν παντάπασι καταφαίνεται.
ATH. But it is indeed possible, as at least at present it appears to me entirely clear.
ΚΛ. μὴ τοίνυν ἀφιστώμεθα μηδενὶ τρόπῳ, πρὶν ἂν τοῦτʼ αὐτὸ ἐκπορισώμεθα τοῖς εἰρημένοις νόμοις· γελοῖον γὰρ τό γε μάτην πονήσαντα ὁτιοῦν εἰς μηδὲν βέβαιον καταβαλεῖν.
CLE. Let us then not desist by any means until we have provided this very thing for the laws we have spoken of; for it is ridiculous, after having labored in vain on anything, to cast it down upon nothing secure.
ΑΘ. ὀρθῶς παρακελεύῃ, καὶ ἐμὲ τοιοῦτον εὑρήσεις ἄλλον.
ATH. You encourage me rightly, and you will find me another such as yourself.
ΚΛ. καλῶς δὴ λέγεις.
CLE. You speak well indeed.
τίς οὖν δή, φῄς, σωτηρία γίγνοιτʼ ἂν καὶ τίνα τρόπον πολιτείᾳ τε καὶ τοῖς νόμοις ἡμῖν;
What preservation, then, do you say would come to be, and in what way, for our constitution and laws?
§12.961ΑΘ. ἆρʼ οὐκ εἴπομεν ὅτι δεῖ σύλλογον ἡμῖν ἐν τῇ πόλει γίγνεσθαι τοιόνδε τινά;
ATH. Did we not say that some such assembly must be established for us in the city?
δέκα μὲν τῶν νομοφυλάκων τοὺς πρεσβυτάτους ἀεί, τοὺς δὲ τἀριστεῖα εἰληφότας ἅπαντας δεῖν εἰς ταὐτὸ συλλέγεσθαι τούτοις, ἔτι δὲ τοὺς ἐκδημήσαντας ἐπὶ ζήτησιν εἴ τί που πρὸς τὴν νομοφυλακίαν γίγνοιτο ἓν καίριον ἀκοῦσαι καὶ σωθέντας οἴκαδε, δόξαι, τούτοις αὐτοῖς διαβασανισθέντας, τοῦ συλλόγου ἀξιοκοινωνήτους εἶναι· πρὸς τούτοις δὲ ἕνα ἕκαστον δεῖν προσλαμβάνειν τῶν νέων, μὴ ἔλαττον ἢ τριάκοντʼ ἔτη γεγονότα, πρῶτον δὲ αὐτὸν κρίναντα ἐπάξιον εἶναι φύσει καὶ τροφῇ, τὸν νέον οὕτως εἰς τοὺς ἄλλους εἰσφέρειν, καὶ ἐὰν μὲν δόξῃ καὶ τοῖς ἄλλοις, προσλαμβάνειν, εἰ δὲ μή, ἀπόρρητον εἶναι τὴν γεγονυῖαν κρίσιν τοῖς τε ἄλλοις δὴ καὶ μάλιστʼ αὐτῷ τῷ ἀποκριθέντι· δεῖν δὲ ὄρθριον εἶναι τὸν σύλλογον, ἡνίκʼ ἂν τῶν ἄλλων πράξεων ἰδίων τε καὶ κοινῶν καὶ μάλιστʼ ᾖ τις σχολὴ παντί.
That ten of the guardians of the laws, always the oldest, and all those who have received the prizes of virtue, must assemble in the same place with these; and further, those who have traveled abroad on inquiry, if anywhere they might hear of some single thing timely for the preservation of the laws, and having returned safe home, if they are approved, having been examined by these very members, to be worthy of sharing in the assembly; and in addition to these, each member must take to himself one of the young men, not less than thirty years old, having first judged him himself to be worthy by nature and training, and so introduce the young man to the others; and if it seems good to the others as well, let them take him in, but if not, let the judgment that took place be kept secret from the others and especially from the rejected candidate himself; and that the assembly must meet at dawn, when there is the greatest leisure for everyone from other business, both private and public.
τοιοῦτόν τί που λεχθὲν ἡμῖν ἦν ἐν τοῖς ἔμπροσθεν λόγοις;
Was some such thing said by us in the previous discourse?
ΚΛ. ἦν γὰρ οὖν.
CLE. Indeed it was.
ΑΘ. τούτου δὴ πέρι τοῦ συλλόγου πάλιν ἀναλαβὼν λέγοιμʼ ἂν τὸ τοιόνδε.
ATH. Concerning this assembly, taking up the discourse again, I would say the following.
φημί, εἴ τις τοῦτον βάλοιτο οἷον ἄγκυραν πάσης τῆς πόλεως, πάντα ἔχουσαν τὰ πρόσφορα ἑαυτῇ, σῴζειν ἂν σύμπαντα ἃ βουλόμεθα.
I say that if anyone should cast this as an anchor of the whole city, having all that is suitable for itself, it would preserve all that we wish.
ΚΛ. πῶς δή;
CLE. How indeed?
ΑΘ. τὸ μετὰ τοῦτο ἡμέτερος ἂν καιρὸς γίγνοιτο ὀρθῶς φράζοντας μηδὲν ἀπολείπειν προθυμίας.
ATH. After this, it would be our opportunity, as we speak correctly, to leave out nothing of eagerness.
ΚΛ. καὶ μάλα καλῶς εἶπες, ποίει θʼ ὥσπερ καὶ διανοῇ.
CLE. And you spoke very well; do indeed as you intend.
ΑΘ. χρὴ τοίνυν, ὦ Κλεινία, παντὸς πέρι νοῆσαι σωτῆρα τὸν εἰκότα ἐν ἑκάστοις τῶν ἔργων, ὡς ἐν ζῴῳ ψυχὴ καὶ κεφαλή, τό γε μέγιστον, πεφύκατον.
ATH. It is necessary then, Cleinias, concerning everything, to conceive of the natural savior in each of the works, as in a living being the soul and the head, at least the greatest parts, are by nature.
ΚΛ. πῶς αὖ φῄς;
CLE. How do you say that again?
ΑΘ. ἡ τούτοιν ἀρετὴ δήπου παντὶ παρέχει ζῴῳ σωτηρίαν.
ATH. The virtue of these two, surely, provides preservation to every living being.
ΚΛ. πῶς;
CLE. How?
ΑΘ. ψυχῇ μὲν πρὸς τοῖς ἄλλοις νοῦς ἐγγιγνόμενος, κεφαλῇ δʼ αὖ πρὸς τοῖς ἄλλοις ὄψις καὶ ἀκοή· συλλήβδην δὲ νοῦς μετὰ τῶν καλλίστων αἰσθήσεων κραθείς, γενόμενός τε εἰς ἕν, σωτηρία ἑκάστων δικαιότατʼ ἂν εἴη καλουμένη.
ATH. In the soul, intellect is engendered in addition to the other faculties, and in the head, sight and hearing in addition to the other senses; and in short, intellect mixed with the most beautiful senses, having become one, would most justly be called the preservation of each.
ΚΛ. ἔοικε γοῦν.
CLE. It seems so, at least.
ΑΘ. ἔοικε γάρ.
ATH. Indeed it seems so.
ἀλλʼ ὁ περὶ τί νοῦς μετʼ αἰσθήσεων κραθεὶς σωτηρία πλοίων ἔν γε χειμῶσιν καὶ ἐν εὐδίαις γίγνοιτʼ ἄν;
But intellect mixed with which senses would become the preservation of ships in storms and in fair weather?
ἆρʼ οὐκ ἐν νηὶ κυβερνήτης ἅμα καὶ ναῦται τὰς αἰσθήσεις τῷ κυβερνητικῷ νῷ συγκερασάμενοι σῴζουσιν αὑτούς τε καὶ τὰ περὶ τὴν ναῦν;
Is it not on a ship that the helmsman and the sailors, mixing their senses with the helmsman's intellect, preserve both themselves and all that concerns the ship?
ΚΛ. τί μήν;
CLE. Of course.