§3.416πῶς, ἔφη, αὖ τοῦτο λέγεις διαφέρειν ἐκείνου; ἐγώ σοι, ἦν δʼ ἐγώ, πειράσομαι εἰπεῖν.
"In what way, he said, do you say this differs from that?" "I will try to tell you," I said.
δεινότατον γάρ που πάντων καὶ αἴσχιστον ποιμέσι τοιούτους γε καὶ οὕτω τρέφειν κύνας ἐπικούρους ποιμνίων, ὥστε ὑπὸ ἀκολασίας ἢ λιμοῦ ἤ τινος ἄλλου κακοῦ ἔθους αὐτοὺς τοὺς κύνας ἐπιχειρῆσαι τοῖς προβάτοις κακουργεῖν καὶ ἀντὶ κυνῶν λύκοις ὁμοιωθῆναι. δεινόν, ἦ δʼ ὅς· πῶς δʼ οὔ; οὐκοῦν φυλακτέον παντὶ τρόπῳ μὴ τοιοῦτον ἡμῖν οἱ ἐπίκουροι ποιήσωσι πρὸς τοὺς πολίτας, ἐπειδὴ αὐτῶν κρείττους εἰσίν, ἀντὶ συμμάχων εὐμενῶν δεσπόταις ἀγρίοις ἀφομοιωθῶσιν; φυλακτέον, ἔφη.
"For it is surely the most terrible and shameful of all things for shepherds to breed such dogs, and in such a way, as helpers of the flocks, that through lack of discipline or hunger or some other bad habit, the dogs themselves should attempt to do harm to the sheep and, instead of dogs, become like wolves." "Terrible indeed," he said; "how could it not be?" "Must we not then guard in every way lest our auxiliaries do such a thing to the citizens, since they are stronger than them, and, instead of being kindly allies, become like savage masters?" "We must guard against it," he said.
οὐκοῦν τὴν μεγίστην τῆς εὐλαβείας παρεσκευασμένοι ἂν εἶεν, εἰ τῷ ὄντι καλῶς πεπαιδευμένοι εἰσίν; ἀλλὰ μὴν εἰσίν γʼ, ἔφη.
"Would they not then have been provided with the greatest safeguard, if they are in fact well educated?" "But indeed they are," he said.
καὶ ἐγὼ εἶπον· τοῦτο μὲν οὐκ ἄξιον διισχυρίζεσθαι, ὦ φίλε Γλαύκων· ὃ μέντοι ἄρτι ἐλέγομεν, ἄξιον, ὅτι δεῖ αὐτοὺς τῆς ὀρθῆς τυχεῖν παιδείας, ἥτις ποτέ ἐστιν, εἰ μέλλουσι τὸ μέγιστον ἔχειν πρὸς τὸ ἥμεροι εἶναι αὑτοῖς τε καὶ τοῖς φυλαττομένοις ὑπʼ αὐτῶν. καὶ ὀρθῶς γε, ἦ δʼ ὅς.
And I said, "To assert this, my dear Glaucon, is not worthwhile; but indeed, what we were just now saying is worthwhile, that they must obtain the right education, whatever it may be, if they are to have what is most important for being gentle to themselves and to those guarded by them." "And rightly so," he said.
πρὸς τοίνυν τῇ παιδείᾳ ταύτῃ φαίη ἄν τις νοῦν ἔχων δεῖν καὶ τὰς οἰκήσεις καὶ τὴν ἄλλην οὐσίαν τοιαύτην αὐτοῖς παρεσκευάσθαι, ἥτις μήτε τοῦ φύλακας ὡς ἀρίστους εἶναι παύσει αὐτούς, κακουργεῖν τε μὴ ἐπαρεῖ περὶ τοὺς ἄλλους πολίτας. καὶ ἀληθῶς γε φήσει.
"In addition to this education, then, anyone with sense would say that both their dwellings and their other property must be prepared for them in such a way as will neither stop them from being the best guardians, nor incite them to do harm to the other citizens." "And he will speak truly indeed," he said.
ὅρα δή, εἶπον ἐγώ, εἰ τοιόνδε τινὰ τρόπον δεῖ αὐτοὺς ζῆν τε καὶ οἰκεῖν, εἰ μέλλουσι τοιοῦτοι ἔσεσθαι· πρῶτον μὲν οὐσίαν κεκτημένον μηδεμίαν μηδένα ἰδίαν, ἂν μὴ πᾶσα ἀνάγκη· ἔπειτα οἴκησιν καὶ ταμιεῖον μηδενὶ εἶναι μηδὲν τοιοῦτον, εἰς ὃ οὐ πᾶς ὁ βουλόμενος εἴσεισι· τὰ δʼ ἐπιτήδεια, ὅσων δέονται ἄνδρες ἀθληταὶ πολέμου σώφρονές τε καὶ ἀνδρεῖοι, ταξαμένους παρὰ τῶν ἄλλων πολιτῶν δέχεσθαι μισθὸν τῆς φυλακῆς τοσοῦτον ὅσον μήτε περιεῖναι αὐτοῖς εἰς τὸν ἐνιαυτὸν μήτε ἐνδεῖν· φοιτῶντας δὲ εἰς συσσίτια ὥσπερ ἐστρατοπεδευμένους κοινῇ ζῆν· §3.417χρυσίον δὲ καὶ ἀργύριον εἰπεῖν αὐτοῖς ὅτι θεῖον παρὰ θεῶν ἀεὶ ἐν τῇ ψυχῇ ἔχουσι καὶ οὐδὲν προσδέονται τοῦ ἀνθρωπείου, οὐδὲ ὅσια τὴν ἐκείνου κτῆσιν τῇ τοῦ θνητοῦ χρυσοῦ κτήσει συμμειγνύντας μιαίνειν, διότι πολλὰ καὶ ἀνόσια περὶ τὸ τῶν πολλῶν νόμισμα γέγονεν, τὸ παρʼ ἐκείνοις δὲ ἀκήρατον· ἀλλὰ μόνοις αὐτοῖς τῶν ἐν τῇ πόλει μεταχειρίζεσθαι καὶ ἅπτεσθαι χρυσοῦ καὶ ἀργύρου οὐ θέμις, οὐδʼ ὑπὸ τὸν αὐτὸν ὄροφον ἰέναι οὐδὲ περιάψασθαι οὐδὲ πίνειν ἐξ ἀργύρου ἢ χρυσοῦ.
"Look then," I said, "whether they must live and dwell in some such way as this, if they are to be of such a kind: first, that no one possesses any private property at all, unless there is absolute necessity; next, that no one has any dwelling or storehouse of such a kind that anyone who wishes cannot enter; and as for provisions, as many as temperate and courageous men who are athletes of war require, they, having agreed on a fixed amount, must receive from the other citizens as a wage for their guardianship, of such an amount as neither to be superfluous for them for the year nor to be deficient; and going regularly to common messes, they must live in common as if in a camp; and as for gold and silver, we must tell them that they always have divine gold and silver from the gods in their souls and have no need of the human kind, nor is it holy to pollute the possession of the former by mixing it with the possession of mortal gold, because many impious things have happened around the currency of the multitude, but that which is in them is undefiled; but to them alone of those in the city is it not lawful to handle or touch gold and silver, nor to go under the same roof with them, nor to wear them, nor to drink from silver or gold.
καὶ οὕτω μὲν σῴζοιντό τʼ ἂν καὶ σῴζοιεν τὴν πόλιν· ὁπότε δʼ αὐτοὶ γῆν τε ἰδίαν καὶ οἰκίας καὶ νομίσματα κτήσονται, οἰκονόμοι μὲν καὶ γεωργοὶ ἀντὶ φυλάκων ἔσονται, δεσπόται δʼ ἐχθροὶ ἀντὶ συμμάχων τῶν ἄλλων πολιτῶν γενήσονται, μισοῦντες δὲ δὴ καὶ μισούμενοι καὶ ἐπιβουλεύοντες καὶ ἐπιβουλευόμενοι διάξουσι πάντα τὸν βίον, πολὺ πλείω καὶ μᾶλλον δεδιότες τοὺς ἔνδον ἢ τοὺς ἔξωθεν πολεμίους, θέοντες ἤδη τότε ἐγγύτατα ὀλέθρου αὐτοί τε καὶ ἡ ἄλλη πόλις.
And in this way they would both save themselves and save the city; but whenever they themselves possess private land and houses and currency, they will be household managers and farmers instead of guardians, and they will become hostile masters instead of allies to the other citizens; and hating and being hated, plotting and being plotted against, they will pass their whole life, fearing those within much more and rather than the enemies from without, running even then very close to destruction, both themselves and the rest of the city.
τούτων οὖν πάντων ἕνεκα, ἦν δʼ ἐγώ, φῶμεν οὕτω δεῖν κατεσκευάσθαι τοὺς φύλακας οἰκήσεώς τε πέρι καὶ τῶν ἄλλων, καὶ ταῦτα νομοθετήσωμεν, ἢ μή; πάνυ γε, ἦ δʼ ὃς ὁ Γλαύκων.
"For all these reasons, then," I said, "shall we say that the guardians must be established in this way regarding dwellings and other things, and shall we make these laws, or not?" "By all means," Glaucon said.