§22Fulgentius dixit: Distringo illum, exsufflo et in remissione peccatorum uera aqua baptizo. Augustinus respondit: Quomodo eius peccata dimittis, cum scriptum sit blasphemiam spiritus sancti in saeculum dimitti non posse? sed hoc omittamus, alterum uideamus.
Fulgentius said: "I restrain him, blow upon him, and baptize him in the true water for the remission of sins." Augustine replied: "How do you forgive his sins, when it is written that blasphemy against the Holy Spirit cannot be forgiven forever? But let us omit this and look at the other thing.
dic et Maximianistae, aemulo tuo, quod et mihi dixisti: \'quomodo alter habere potest, si mihi soli concessum est? aut si iuri tuo asseris traditum, quare comprobas alienum?\' respondebit et iste Maximianista: \'quomodo alter habere non potest, cum et mihi sicut tibi tu probaueris esse concessum? christianos enim meos et clericos extra ecclesiam tuam baptizatos uel ordinatos absque ulla demutatione baptismi uel honoris in integro recepisti! quod tibi Marcellini gestis obiectum refellere nullatenus ualuisti. Item Augustinus respondit: Si iustus es, cur sententia tua diuersa est? cur Maximianistam suscipis et meos fideles exsufflas?
Fulgentius dixit: Quia ille meus erat. Augustinus respondit: Et tu mens eras.
Tell your rival, the Maximianist, what you also said to me: 'How can another have it, if it has been granted to me alone? Or if you assert that it was delivered to your right, why do you approve of what belongs to another?' And that Maximianist will reply: 'How can another not have it, when you yourself have proved that it was granted to me just as to you? For you received my Christians and clerics, who were baptized or ordained outside your church, in their entirety without any change of baptism or office! You were in no way able to refute this, which was objected to you by the acts of Marcellinus.'" Again Augustine replied: "If you are righteous, why is your judgment different? Why do you receive the Maximianist and blow upon my faithful?" Fulgentius said: "Because he was mine." Augustine replied: "And you were mine.
cur in schismatico tuo pius, in catholico impius et inplacabilis perseueras?
Why do you persist in being pious toward your schismatic, but impious and implacable toward a Catholic?
§23Fulgentius dixit: Plus peccasti, et ideo in te aliter uindicatur. Augustinus respondit: Quid ergo? baptisma pro uindicta ponis et quod ad salutem promittitur a te pro poena tribuitur? si in baptismo non delicta donas, sed peccata castigas, si in aqua non liberas, sed flagellas, piratam esse te aperte demonstras.
"Fulgentius said: "You sinned more, and therefore it is punished differently in your case." Augustine replied: "What then? Do you set up baptism for vengeance, and is what is promised for salvation bestowed by you as a punishment? If in baptism you do not forgive faults but chastise sins, if in the water you do not set free but scourge, you openly show yourself to be a pirate.
sed tamen quid plus peccaui, quid feci?
Fulgentius dixit: Codices tradidisti et idolis immolasti. Augustinus respondit: Doce.
But still, what greater sin did I commit, what did I do?" Fulgentius said: "You surrendered the holy books and sacrificed to idols." Augustine replied: "Prove it.
non feci; facta tua mihi subponis. Fulgentius dixit: Pater tuus fecit. Augustinus respondit: Ego patrem nescio nisi deum.
I did not do it; you are attributing your own deeds to me." Fulgentius said: "Your father did it." Augustine replied: "I know no father except God.
scriptum est enim: nolite uobis uocare patrem super terram; unus est enim pater uester caelestis. Fulgentius dixit: Patrem tuum dico Caecilianum.
For it is written: Do not call anyone on earth your father; for one is your heavenly Father." Fulgentius said: "I call Caecilian your father.
ipse tradidit, ipse turificauit, ipse omnia mala commisit. Augustinus respondit: Lege - quis illum accusauit, quis conuicit, quis coram positum condemnauit.
He himself surrendered, he himself burned incense, he himself committed all evils." Augustine replied: "Read—who accused him, who convicted him, who condemned him in his presence?
esto, fecit quod non fecit: numquid filius pro patre damnabor, cum scriptum sit: anima patris mea est et anima filii mea est. anima quae peccauerit sola morietur?
Fulgentius dixit: Tu filius eius non quidem tradidisti, sed nobis persecutionem fecisti. --
Augustinus respondit: Equidem non feci, credo tamen quod mei facere potuerunt.
Granted, let us suppose he did what he did not do: shall I, a son, be condemned for my father, when it is written: The soul of the father is mine, and the soul of the son is mine; the soul that sins, it alone shall die?" Fulgentius said: "You, his son, did not indeed surrender the books, but you brought persecution upon us." Augustine replied: "I indeed did not do it, yet I believe that my people could have done it.
quaero causam quare.
I ask for the reason why.
quid, si merebamini? non enim malos persequi peccatum est.
What if you deserved it? For it is not a sin to pursue the wicked.
nam et sanctos et sanctum sanctorum dominum malos legimus persecutos.
Indeed, we read that both the saints and the Lord, the Holy of Holies, pursued the wicked.
daemones namque persecutionem domini non ferentes clamabant: quid nobis et tibi, Iesu fili dei? uenisti perdere nos? et Paulus Elimam magum ultus est caecitate et blasphemum hominem tradidit satanae, et Petrus Ananiam et Sapphiram eius uxorem mendaces occidit et Simonem magum tamdiu persecutus est, donec morte perimeret.
For the demons, not enduring the Lord's pursuit, cried out: 'What have we to do with you, Jesus, Son of God? Have you come to destroy us?' And Paul punished Elymas the magician with blindness and delivered the blasphemous man to Satan, and Peter killed Ananias and his wife Sapphira, who were liars, and pursued Simon Magus until he destroyed him by death.
sed et Dauid in persona Christi clamat et dicit: persequar inimicos meos et conprehendam illos, et non conuertar donec deficiant.
But David also, in the person of Christ, cries out and says: 'I will pursue my enemies and overtake them, and I will not turn back until they are consumed.
affligam illos nec poterunt stare. non igitur omnis qui persecutionem passus est iustus continuo putandus est, sed qui propter iustitiam passus est, ille profecto beatus est dicente Petro: quae enim gloria est, si peccantes colaphizantes suffertis? sed si bene facientes patimini et patienter sustinetis, haec est gratia apud deum.
I will crush them and they shall not be able to stand.' Therefore, not everyone who has suffered persecution is immediately to be thought righteous, but he who has suffered for the sake of justice, he indeed is blessed, as Peter says: 'For what glory is it, if, when you sin and are buffeted, you endure it? But if when you do good and suffer, you endure it patiently, this is a grace before God.'"