§8.3.29ἐκ τούτων δὴ πῶς ἂν ἢ τὸν Ἠλιακὸν Πύλον ὑπολάβοι τις ἢ τὸν Μεσσηνιακὸν λέγεσθαι;
From these things indeed, how could anyone suppose that either the Eleian Pylos or the Messenian is meant?
τὸν μὲν Ἠλιακόν, ὅτι τούτου πορθουμένου συνεπορθεῖτο καὶ ἡ τῶν Ἐπειῶν ὑπὸ τοῦ Ἡρακλέους· αὕτη δʼ ἐστὶν ἡ Ἠλεία.
As for the Eleian, because when this was plundered, the territory of the Epeians was also plundered by Heracles; and this is Elis.
πῶς οὖν ἤμελλον οἱ συμπεπορθημένοι καὶ ὁμόφυλοι τοιαύτην ὑπερηφανίαν καὶ ὕβριν κτήσασθαι κατὰ τῶν συναδικηθέντων;
How then were those who had been plundered together and were of the same tribe likely to acquire such arrogance and insolence against those who had been wronged together with them?
πῶς δʼ ἂν τὴν οἰκείαν κατέτρεχον καὶ ἐλεηλάτουν;
And how could they overrun and plunder their own territory?
πῶς δʼ ἂν ἅμα καὶ Αὐγέας ἦρχε τῶν αὐτῶν καὶ Νηλεὺς ἐχθροὶ ὄντες ἀλλήλων;
And how could both Augeas and Neleus rule the same people at the same time, being enemies of one another?
εἴγε τῷ Νηλεῖ
"
χρεῖος μέγʼ ὀφείλετʼ ἐν Ἤλιδι δίῃ,
τέσσαρες ἀθλοφόροι ἵπποι αὐτοῖσιν ὄχεσφιν,
ἐλθόντες μετʼ ἄεθλα· περὶ τρίποδος γὰρ ἔμελλον
θεύσεσθαι· τοὺς δʼ αὖθι ἄναξ ἀνδρῶν Αὐγείας
κάσχεθε, τὸν δʼ ἐλατῆρʼ ἀφίει.
If indeed to Neleus "a great debt was owed in divine Elis, four prize-winning horses with their chariots, which had gone for the prizes; for they were about to run for a tripod; but them the lord of men Augeas detained there, and sent away the driver.
"
εἰ δʼ ἐνταῦθα ᾤκει ὁ Νηλεύς, ἐνταῦθα καὶ ὁ Νέστωρ ἐπῆρχε.
"And if Neleus dwelt here, here also Nestor ruled.
πῶς οὖν τῶν μὲν Ἠλείων καὶ Βουπρασίων
"
τέσσαρες ἀρχοὶ ἔσαν, δέκα δʼ ἀνδρὶ ἑκάστῳ
νῆες ἕποντο θοαί, πολέες δʼ ἔμβαινον Ἐπειοί;
How then, of the Eleians and Bouprasians, "there were four leaders, and ten swift ships followed each man, and many Epeians embarked"?
"
εἰς τέτταρα δὲ καὶ ἡ χώρα διῄρητο, ὧν οὐδενὸς ἐπῆρχεν ὁ Νέστωρ,
"
οἳ δὲ Πύλον τʼ ἐνέμοντο καὶ Ἀρήνην ἐρατεινήν
"
καὶ τὰ ἑξῆς τὰ μέχρι Μεσσήνης;
And the territory was divided into four parts, of none of which Nestor ruled, "and those who inhabited Pylos and lovely Arene "and the next places as far as Messene?
οἱ δὲ δὴ ἀντεπεξιόντες Ἐπειοὶ τοῖς Πυλίοις πῶς ἐπὶ τὸν Ἀλφειὸν ἐξορμῶσι καὶ τὸ Θρύον;
And how do the Epeians who came out against the Pylians set out for the Alpheios and Thryon?
πῶς δʼ ἐκεῖ τῆς μάχης γενομένης τρεφθέντες ἐπὶ Βουπρασίου φεύγουσι;
And how, when the battle occurred there, do they, having been routed, flee toward Bouprasion?
πάλιν δʼ, εἰ τὸν Μεσσηνιακὸν Πύλον ἐπόρθησεν ὁ Ἡρακλῆς, πῶς οἱ τοσοῦτον ἀφεστῶτες ὕβριζον εἰς αὐτούς, καὶ ἐν συμβολαίοις ἦσαν πολλοῖς, καὶ ταῦτʼ ἀπεστέρουν χρεοκοποῦντες, ὥστε διὰ ταῦτα συμβῆναι τὸν πόλεμον;
On the other hand, if Heracles plundered the Messenian Pylos, how did those who were so far distant treat them with insolence, and were involved in many contracts, and deprived them of these by defrauding them of their debts, so that the war occurred because of these things?
πῶς δὲ ἐπὶ τὴν λεηλασίαν ἐξιὼν Νέστωρ τοσαύτην περιελάσας λείαν συῶν τε καὶ προβάτων, ὧν οὐδὲν ὠκυπορεῖν οὐδὲ μακροπορεῖν δύναται, πλειόνων ἢ χιλίων σταδίων ὁδὸν διήνυσεν εἰς τὴν πρὸς τῷ Κορυφασίῳ Πύλον, οἱ δὲ τρίτῳ ἤματι πάντες ἐπὶ τὴν Θρυόεσσαν καὶ τὸν ποταμὸν τὸν Ἀλφειὸν ἥκουσι πολιορκήσοντες τὸ φρούριον;
And how did Nestor, going out for the plunder, having driven off so much booty of swine and sheep, none of which is able to travel swiftly or to go a long distance, accomplish a journey of more than a thousand stades to the Pylos near Coryphasion, while they on the third day all came to Thryoessa and the river Alpheios to besiege the stronghold?
πῶς δὲ ταῦτα τὰ χωρία προσήκοντα ἦν τοῖς ἐν τῇ Μεσσηνίᾳ δυναστεύουσιν ἐχόντων Καυκώνων καὶ Τριφυλίων καὶ Πισατῶν;
And how were these places belonging to those who held power in Messenia, when the Cauconians and Triphylians and Pisatans held them?
τὰ δὲ Γέρηνα ἢ τὴν Γερηνίαν (ἀμφοτέρως γὰρ λέγεται) τάχα μὲν ἐπίτηδες ὠνόμασάν τινες· δύναται δὲ καὶ κατὰ τύχην οὕτως ὠνομάσθαι τὸ χωρίον.
As for Gerena or Gerenia (for it is called in both ways), perhaps indeed some named it so on purpose; but it is also possible that the place was so named by chance.
τὸ δʼ ὅλον, τῆς Μεσσηνίας ὑπὸ Μενελάῳ τεταγμένης, ὑφʼ ᾧ καὶ ἡ Λακωνικὴ ἐτέτακτο (ὡς δῆλον ἔσται καὶ ἐκ τῶν ὕστερον), καὶ τοῦ μὲν Παμισοῦ ῥέοντος διὰ ταύτης καὶ τοῦ Νέδωνος, Ἀλφειοῦ δʼ οὐδαμῶς
"
ὅς τʼ εὐρὺ ῥέει Πυλίων διὰ γαίης,
"
ἧς ἐπῆρχεν ὁ Νέστωρ, τίς ἂν γένοιτο πιθανὸς λόγος εἰς τὴν ἀλλοτρίαν ἀρχὴν ἐκβιβάζων τὸν ἄνδρα, ἀφαιρούμενος δὲ τὰς συγκαταλεγείσας αὐτῷ πόλεις πάνθʼ ὑπʼ ἐκείνῳ ποιῶν;
In short, since Messenia was arranged under Menelaus, under whom the Laconic territory was also arranged (as will be clear also from what follows), and the Pamisus flows through it, and the Nedon, but the Alpheios in no way, "which flows widely through the land of the Pylians, "over which Nestor ruled, what plausible argument could there be that ejects the man into another's dominion, and deprives him of the cities enumerated with him, making them all under that other?