§7.790ΑΘ. εἰς δύναμιν δὲ ἰσχυρὰς αὐτὰς εἶναι χρεὼν καὶ μὴ μίαν;
ATH.: And should they be as strong as possible, and not just one?
ἐπὶ δὲ τούτοις ἑκάστοις, ἂν μὴ γίγνηται, ζημίαν τοῖς μὴ ποιοῦσι γράφωμεν;
And for each of these things, if they are not done, should we write down a penalty for those who do not do them?
ἢ πολλοῦ γε δεῖ;
Or is it far from necessary?
τὸ γὰρ ἄρτι ῥηθὲν γίγνοιτʼ ἂν πολὺ καὶ ἄφθονον.
For what was just said would happen in great and abundant measure.
ΚΛ. τὸ ποῖον;
CLIN.: What sort of thing?
ΑΘ. τὸ γέλωτα ἂν πολὺν ὀφλεῖν ἡμᾶς πρὸς τῷ μὴ ἐθέλειν ἂν πείθεσθαι γυναικεῖά τε καὶ δούλεια ἤθη τροφῶν.
ATH.: Our incurring much ridicule, in addition to the fact that the female and slavish habits of the nurses would not be willing to obey.
ΚΛ. ἀλλὰ τίνος δὴ χάριν ἔφαμεν αὐτὰ δεῖν ῥηθῆναι;
CLIN.: But for the sake of what, then, did we say they must be spoken?
ΑΘ. τοῦδε· τὰ τῶν δεσποτῶν τε καὶ ἐλευθέρων ἐν ταῖς πόλεσιν ἤθη τάχʼ ἂν ἀκούσαντα εἰς σύννοιαν ἀφίκοιτʼ ἂν τὴν ὀρθήν, ὅτι χωρὶς τῆς ἰδίας διοικήσεως ἐν ταῖς πόλεσιν ὀρθῆς γιγνομένης μάτην ἂν τὰ κοινά τις οἴοιτο ἕξειν τινὰ βεβαιότητα θέσεως νόμων, καὶ ταῦτα ἐννοῶν, αὐτὸς νόμοις ἂν τοῖς νῦν ῥηθεῖσιν χρῷτο, καὶ χρώμενος, εὖ τήν τε οἰκίαν καὶ πόλιν ἅμα τὴν αὑτοῦ διοικῶν, εὐδαιμονοῖ.
ATH.: For this reason: that the characters of the masters and free men in the states, having heard them, might perhaps come to the correct understanding, namely that without the correct private administration in the states, one would think in vain that the public laws would have any stability in their establishment; and reflecting on this, he would himself make use of the laws now spoken of, and by making use of them, administering well both his own house and his city at the same time, he would be happy.
ΚΛ. καὶ μάλʼ εἰκότως εἴρηκας.
CLIN.: And you have spoken very reasonably.
ΑΘ. τοιγαροῦν μήπω λήξωμεν τῆς τοιαύτης νομοθεσίας, πρὶν ἂν καὶ τὰ περὶ τὰς ψυχὰς τῶν πάνυ νέων παίδων ἐπιτηδεύματα ἀποδῶμεν κατὰ τὸν αὐτὸν τρόπον ὅνπερ ἤργμεθα τῶν περὶ τὰ σώματα μύθων λεχθέντων διαπεραίνειν.
ATH.: Therefore let us not yet cease from such legislation, before we have also delivered the practices concerning the souls of the very young children in the same manner as we began to carry through the discussion of what was said about their bodies.
ΚΛ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν ὀρθῶς.
CLIN.: Quite correctly.
ΑΘ. λάβωμεν τοίνυν τοῦτο οἷον στοιχεῖον ἐπʼ ἀμφότερα, σώματός τε καὶ ψυχῆς τῶν πάνυ νέων τὴν τιθήνησιν καὶ κίνησιν γιγνομένην ὅτι μάλιστα διὰ πάσης τε νυκτὸς καὶ ἡμέρας, ὡς ἔστι σύμφορος ἅπασι μέν, οὐχ ἥκιστα δὲ τοῖς ὅτι νεωτάτοισι, καὶ οἰκεῖν, εἰ δυνατὸν ἦν, οἷον ἀεὶ πλέοντας·
ATH.: Let us then take this as a sort of element for both: that the nursing and movement of the very young, both of body and of soul, occurring as much as possible through every night and day, is beneficial to all, but not least to the very youngest, and to live, if it were possible, as if always sailing.
νῦν δʼ ὡς ἐγγύτατα τούτου ποιεῖν δεῖ περὶ τὰ νεογενῆ παίδων θρέμματα.
But now we must act as closely as possible to this regarding the newborn nurslings of children.
τεκμαίρεσθαι δὲ χρὴ καὶ ἀπὸ τῶνδε, ὡς ἐξ ἐμπειρίας αὐτὸ εἰλήφασι καὶ ἐγνώκασιν ὂν χρήσιμον αἵ τε τροφοὶ τῶν σμικρῶν καὶ αἱ περὶ τὰ τῶν Κορυβάντων ἰάματα τελοῦσαι·
And we must infer this also from these things: how both the nurses of the small ones and those who perform the remedies for the Corybantes have grasped it from experience and known it to be useful.
ἡνίκα γὰρ ἄν που βουληθῶσιν κατακοιμίζειν τὰ δυσυπνοῦντα τῶν παιδίων αἱ μητέρες, οὐχ ἡσυχίαν αὐτοῖς προσφέρουσιν ἀλλὰ τοὐναντίον κίνησιν, ἐν ταῖς ἀγκάλαις ἀεὶ σείουσαι, καὶ οὐ σιγὴν ἀλλά τινα μελῳδίαν, καὶ ἀτεχνῶς οἷον καταυλοῦσι τῶν παιδίων, καθάπερ ἡ τῶν ἐκφρόνων βακχειῶν ἰάσεις, ταύτῃ τῇ τῆς κινήσεως ἅμα χορείᾳ καὶ μούσῃ χρώμεναι.
For whenever mothers wish to lull to sleep those of the children who are hard to sleep, they do not offer them stillness but on the contrary movement, always shaking them in their arms, and not silence but some melody, and literally, as it were, they pipe to the children, just like the remedies of those madly celebrating Bacchic rites, employing this combined dance and music of movement.
ΚΛ. τίς οὖν αἰτία τούτων, ὦ ξένε, μάλιστʼ ἔσθʼ ἡμῖν;
CLIN.: What then, stranger, is the cause of these things for us?
ΑΘ. οὐ πάνυ χαλεπὴ γιγνώσκειν.
ATH.: Not very difficult to know.
ΚΛ. πῶς δή;
CLIN.: How so?
§7.791ΑΘ. δειμαίνειν ἐστίν που ταῦτʼ ἀμφότερα τὰ πάθη, καὶ ἔστι δείματα διʼ ἕξιν φαύλην τῆς ψυχῆς τινα.
ATH.: Both of these states are surely a kind of fear, and they are fears due to some bad condition of the soul.
ὅταν οὖν ἔξωθέν τις προσφέρῃ τοῖς τοιούτοις πάθεσι σεισμόν, ἡ τῶν ἔξωθεν κρατεῖ κίνησις προσφερομένη τὴν ἐντὸς φοβερὰν οὖσαν καὶ μανικὴν κίνησιν, κρατήσασα δέ, γαλήνην ἡσυχίαν τε ἐν τῇ ψυχῇ φαίνεσθαι ἀπεργασαμένη τῆς περὶ τὰ τῆς καρδίας χαλεπῆς γενομένης ἑκάστων πηδήσεως, παντάπασιν ἀγαπητόν τι, τοὺς μὲν ὕπνου λαγχάνειν ποιεῖ, τοὺς δʼ ἐγρηγορότας ὀρχουμένους τε καὶ αὐλουμένους μετὰ θεῶν, οἷς ἂν καλλιεροῦντες ἕκαστοι θύωσι, κατηργάσατο ἀντὶ μανικῶν ἡμῖν διαθέσεων ἕξεις ἔμφρονας ἔχειν.
Therefore, when one applies a shaking from without to such states, the motion applied from without masters the internal motion, which is fearful and manic; and having mastered it, and having brought about a calm and quiet to appear in the soul by stopping the distressing pounding of the heart that had occurred in each, it produces an altogether desirable thing: it makes some obtain sleep, and others, who are awake, dancing and piping with the gods to whom they sacrifice with good omens, it has brought about that they have sane habits instead of manic dispositions.
καὶ ταῦτα, ὡς διὰ βραχέων γε οὕτως εἰπεῖν, πιθανὸν λόγον ἔχει τινά.
And these things, to speak thus briefly, have some plausible explanation.
ΚΛ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν.
CLIN.: Quite so.
ΑΘ. εἰ δέ γε οὕτως τοιαύτην τινὰ δύναμιν ἔχει ταῦτα, ἐννοεῖν χρὴ τόδε παρʼ αὑτοῖς, ὡς ἅπασα ψυχὴ δείμασιν συνοῦσα ἐκ νέων μᾶλλον ἂν διὰ φόβων ἐθίζοιτο γίγνεσθαι·
ATH.: But if these things have indeed some such power, we must reflect on this in our minds: that every soul living with fears from youth would be more accustomed to become fearful through fears; and this, I suppose, everyone would say is an exercise of cowardice, but not of courage.
τοῦτο δέ που πᾶς ἂν φαίη δειλίας ἄσκησιν ἀλλʼ οὐκ ἀνδρείας γίγνεσθαι.
CLIN.: How indeed could it not be?
ΚΛ. πῶς γὰρ οὔ;
ATH.: And the opposite, we would say, is a practice of courage straight from youth, namely to conquer the fears and terrors that fall upon us.
ΑΘ. τὸ δέ γε ἐναντίον ἀνδρείας ἂν φαῖμεν ἐκ νέων εὐθὺς ἐπιτήδευμα εἶναι, τὸ νικᾶν τὰ προσπίπτονθʼ ἡμῖν δείματά τε καὶ φόβους.
CLIN.: Correctly.
ΚΛ. ὀρθῶς.
ATH.: Let us say, then, that this one thing also contributes greatly for us to that part of the virtue of the soul, namely the gymnastics of very young children in movements.
ΑΘ. ἓν δὴ καὶ τοῦτο εἰς ψυχῆς μόριον ἀρετῆς, τὴν τῶν παντελῶς παίδων γυμναστικὴν ἐν ταῖς κινήσεσιν, μέγα ἡμῖν φῶμεν συμβάλλεσθαι.
CLIN.: Quite so.
ΚΛ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν.
ATH.: And indeed, a good-tempered state in the soul and a bad-tempered one, each becoming no small part of excellence of soul and baseness of soul respectively, would so result.
ΑΘ. καὶ μὴν τό γε μὴ δύσκολον ἐν ψυχῇ καὶ τὸ δύσκολον οὐ σμικρὸν μόριον εὐψυχίας καὶ κακοψυχίας ἑκάτερον γιγνόμενον γίγνοιτʼ ἄν.
CLIN.: How not?
ΚΛ. πῶς δʼ οὔ;
ATH.: In what way, then, might whichever of the two we wish immediately grow in the newborn for us?
ΑΘ. τίνα οὖν ἂν τρόπον εὐθὺς ἐμφύοιθʼ ἡμῖν ὁπότερον βουληθεῖμεν τῷ νεογενεῖ, φράζειν δὴ πειρατέον ὅπως τις καὶ καθʼ ὅσον εὐπορεῖ τούτων.
We must try to tell how and to what extent one has resources for these things.
ΚΛ. πῶς γὰρ οὔ;
CLIN.: How indeed not?
ΑΘ. λέγω δὴ τό γε παρʼ ἡμῖν δόγμα, ὡς ἡ μὲν τρυφὴ δύσκολα καὶ ἀκράχολα καὶ σφόδρα ἀπὸ σμικρῶν κινούμενα τὰ τῶν νέων ἤθη ἀπεργάζεται, τὸ δὲ τούτων ἐναντίον, ἥ τε σφοδρὰ καὶ ἀγρία δούλωσις, ταπεινοὺς καὶ ἀνελευθέρους καὶ μισανθρώπους ποιοῦσα, ἀνεπιτηδείους συνοίκους ἀποτελεῖ.
ATH.: I say, then, our doctrine is that luxury makes the characters of the young bad-tempered and irritable and violently stirred by small things; while the opposite of these, namely violent and savage enslavement, making them humble, unfree, and misanthropic, renders them unfit companions.
ΚΛ. πῶς οὖν δὴ χρὴ τὰ μήπω φωνῆς συνιέντα, μηδὲ παιδείας τῆς ἄλλης δυνατὰ γεύεσθαί πω, τρέφειν τὴν πόλιν ἅπασαν;
CLIN.: How then indeed must the whole state nurture those who do not yet understand speech, nor are yet able to taste of any other education?
ΑΘ. ὧδέ πως· φθέγγεσθαί που μετὰ βοῆς εὐθὺς πᾶν εἴωθεν τὸ γενόμενον, καὶ οὐχ ἥκιστα τὸ τῶν ἀνθρώπων γένος· καὶ δὴ καὶ τῷ κλάειν πρὸς τῇ βοῇ μᾶλλον τῶν ἄλλων συνέχεται.
ATH.: In some such way: everything that is born is surely accustomed to utter sounds with crying immediately, and not least the race of humans; and indeed, it is also constrained by weeping in addition to crying more than the others.
ΚΛ. πάνυ μὲν οὖν.
CLIN.: Quite so.