§324ΣΩ.
ὧν ἐστιν ἓν καὶ ἡ ἀδικία καὶ ἡ ἀσέβεια καὶ συλλήβδην πᾶν τὸ ἐναντίον τῆς πολιτικῆς ἀρετῆς·
Socrates: Among which is one, indeed, injustice, and impiety, and, in a word, all that is contrary to political virtue; where indeed everyone gets angry with and admonishes everyone, clearly on the ground that it is acquirable by diligence and learning.
ἔνθα δὴ πᾶς παντὶ θυμοῦται καὶ νουθετεῖ, δῆλον ὅτι ὡς ἐξ ἐπιμελείας καὶ μαθήσεως κτητῆς οὔσης. εἰ γὰρ ἐθέλεις ἐννοῆσαι τὸ κολάζειν, ὦ Σώκρατες, τοὺς ἀδικοῦντας τί ποτε δύναται, αὐτό σε διδάξει ὅτι οἵ γε ἄνθρωποι ἡγοῦνται παρασκευαστὸν εἶναι ἀρετήν.
For if you wish to consider, Socrates, what the punishment of those who do wrong actually means, it will teach you itself that humans believe virtue is something that can be acquired.
οὐδεὶς γὰρ κολάζει τοὺς ἀδικοῦντας πρὸς τούτῳ τὸν νοῦν ἔχων καὶ τούτου ἕνεκα, ὅτι ἠδίκησεν, ὅστις μὴ ὥσπερ θηρίον ἀλογίστως τιμωρεῖται· ὁ δὲ μετὰ λόγου ἐπιχειρῶν κολάζειν οὐ τοῦ παρεληλυθότος ἕνεκα ἀδικήματος τιμωρεῖται—οὐ γὰρ ἂν τό γε πραχθὲν ἀγένητον θείη—ἀλλὰ τοῦ μέλλοντος χάριν, ἵνα μὴ αὖθις ἀδικήσῃ μήτε αὐτὸς οὗτος μήτε ἄλλος ὁ τοῦτον ἰδὼν κολασθέντα.
For no one punishes those who do wrong keeping his mind on this and for this reason, that they did wrong, unless he punishes mindlessly like a wild beast; but he who attempts to punish with reason does not punish for the sake of the past wrong—for he could not make what has been done undone—but for the sake of the future, so that neither this person himself may do wrong again, nor anyone else who sees him punished.
καὶ τοιαύτην διάνοιαν ἔχων διανοεῖται παιδευτὴν εἶναι ἀρετήν· ἀποτροπῆς γοῦν ἕνεκα κολάζει.
And having such a thought, he believes that virtue is teachable; at least he punishes for the sake of deterrence.
ταύτην οὖν τὴν δόξαν πάντες ἔχουσιν ὅσοιπερ τιμωροῦνται καὶ ἰδίᾳ καὶ δημοσίᾳ.
This opinion, then, all have who punish either privately or publicly.
τιμωροῦνται δὲ καὶ κολάζονται οἵ τε ἄλλοι ἄνθρωποι οὓς ἂν οἴωνται ἀδικεῖν, καὶ οὐχ ἥκιστα Ἀθηναῖοι οἱ σοὶ πολῖται· ὥστε κατὰ τοῦτον τὸν λόγον καὶ Ἀθηναῖοί εἰσι τῶν ἡγουμένων παρασκευαστὸν εἶναι καὶ διδακτὸν ἀρετήν.
And indeed other humans punish and discipline those whom they think do wrong, and not least your own citizens, the Athenians; so that according to this argument, the Athenians also are among those who believe virtue is something to be acquired and taught.
ὡς μὲν οὖν εἰκότως ἀποδέχονται οἱ σοὶ πολῖται καὶ χαλκέως καὶ σκυτοτόμου συμβουλεύοντος τὰ πολιτικά, καὶ ὅτι διδακτὸν καὶ παρασκευαστὸν ἡγοῦνται ἀρετήν, ἀποδέδεικταί σοι, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἱκανῶς, ὥς γέ μοι φαίνεται.
That your citizens, therefore, reasonably accept even a smith and a shoemaker advising on political matters, and that they believe virtue is teachable and acquirable, has been sufficiently demonstrated to you, Socrates, as indeed it seems to me.
ἔτι δὴ λοιπὴ ἀπορία ἐστίν, ἣν ἀπορεῖς περὶ τῶν ἀνδρῶν τῶν ἀγαθῶν, τί δήποτε οἱ ἄνδρες οἱ ἀγαθοὶ τὰ μὲν ἄλλα τοὺς αὑτῶν ὑεῖς διδάσκουσιν ἃ διδασκάλων ἔχεται καὶ σοφοὺς ποιοῦσιν, ἣν δὲ αὐτοὶ ἀρετὴν ἀγαθοὶ οὐδενὸς βελτίους ποιοῦσιν.
Yet there still remains a problem which you are puzzled about concerning good men: why on earth do good men teach their sons other things that depend on teachers and make them wise, but make them no better than anyone else in the very virtue in which they themselves are good?
τούτου δὴ πέρι, ὦ Σώκρατες, οὐκέτι μῦθόν σοι ἐρῶ ἀλλὰ λόγον.
Concerning this, Socrates, I will no longer tell you a myth, but a rational argument.
ὧδε γὰρ ἐννόησον· πότερον ἔστιν τι ἓν ἢ οὐκ ἔστιν οὗ ἀναγκαῖον πάντας τοὺς πολίτας μετέχειν, εἴπερ μέλλει πόλις εἶναι;
For consider it thus: is there some one thing, or is there not, which it is necessary for all citizens to share in, if a city is to exist?
ἐν τούτῳ γὰρ αὕτη λύεται ἡ ἀπορία ἣν σὺ ἀπορεῖς ἢ ἄλλοθι οὐδαμοῦ.
For in this is solved this very problem about which you are puzzled, or nowhere else.
§325ΣΩ.
εἰ μὲν γὰρ ἔστιν, καὶ τοῦτό ἐστιν τὸ ἓν οὐ τεκτονικὴ οὐδὲ χαλκεία οὐδὲ κεραμεία ἀλλὰ δικαιοσύνη καὶ σωφροσύνη καὶ τὸ ὅσιον εἶναι, καὶ συλλήβδην ἓν αὐτὸ προσαγορεύω εἶναι ἀνδρὸς ἀρετήν—εἰ τοῦτʼ ἐστὶν οὗ δεῖ πάντας μετέχειν καὶ μετὰ τούτου πάντʼ ἄνδρα, ἐάν τι καὶ ἄλλο βούληται μανθάνειν ἢ πράττειν, οὕτω πράττειν, ἄνευ δὲ τούτου μή, ἢ τὸν μὴ μετέχοντα καὶ διδάσκειν καὶ κολάζειν καὶ παῖδα καὶ ἄνδρα καὶ γυναῖκα, ἕωσπερ ἂν κολαζόμενος βελτίων γένηται, ὃς δʼ ἂν μὴ ὑπακούῃ κολαζόμενος καὶ διδασκόμενος, ὡς ἀνίατον ὄντα τοῦτον ἐκβάλλειν ἐκ τῶν πόλεων ἢ ἀποκτείνειν—εἰ οὕτω μὲν ἔχει, οὕτω δʼ αὐτοῦ πεφυκότος οἱ ἀγαθοὶ ἄνδρες εἰ τὰ μὲν ἄλλα διδάσκονται τοὺς ὑεῖς, τοῦτο δὲ μή, σκέψαι ὡς θαυμασίως γίγνονται οἱ ἀγαθοί.
Socrates: For if there is, and this one thing is not carpentry or smithing or pottery, but justice and temperance and being holy, and in a word, I call it by one name, the virtue of a man—if this is what all must share in, and with this every man, if he wishes to learn or do anything else, must so do it, but not without this, or else the one who does not share in it must be taught and punished, whether child or man or woman, until by being punished he becomes better, and he who does not obey when punished and taught must be, as being incurable, banished from the cities or put to death—if it is so, and if, its nature being such, good men have their sons taught other things but not this, see how wonderfully the good men turn out.
ὅτι μὲν γὰρ διδακτὸν αὐτὸ ἡγοῦνται καὶ ἰδίᾳ καὶ δημοσίᾳ, ἀπεδείξαμεν· διδακτοῦ δὲ ὄντος καὶ θεραπευτοῦ τὰ μὲν ἄλλα ἄρα τοὺς ὑεῖς διδάσκονται, ἐφʼ οἷς οὐκ ἔστι θάνατος ἡ ζημία ἐὰν μὴ ἐπίστωνται, ἐφʼ ᾧ δὲ ἥ τε ζημία θάνατος αὐτῶν τοῖς παισὶ καὶ φυγαὶ μὴ μαθοῦσι μηδὲ θεραπευθεῖσιν εἰς ἀρετήν, καὶ πρὸς τῷ θανάτῳ χρημάτων τε δημεύσεις καὶ ὡς ἔπος εἰπεῖν συλλήβδην τῶν οἴκων ἀνατροπαί, ταῦτα δʼ ἄρα οὐ διδάσκονται οὐδʼ ἐπιμελοῦνται πᾶσαν ἐπιμέλειαν;
For we have demonstrated that they believe it is teachable both privately and publicly; and since it is teachable and cultivated, do they then have their sons taught other things, for which the penalty is not death if they do not know them, but that on which the penalty is death and banishment for their children if they do not learn and are not cultivated in virtue, and, in addition to death, confiscations of property and, so to speak, the utter ruin of their houses—do they then not teach them this, nor pay every attention to it?
οἴεσθαί γε χρή, ὦ Σώκρατες.
One must indeed think they do, Socrates.
ἐκ παίδων σμικρῶν ἀρξάμενοι, μέχρι οὗπερ ἂν ζῶσι, καὶ διδάσκουσι καὶ νουθετοῦσιν.
Starting from small children, as long as they live, they both teach and admonish them.
ἐπειδὰν θᾶττον συνιῇ τις τὰ λεγόμενα, καὶ τροφὸς καὶ μήτηρ καὶ παιδαγωγὸς καὶ αὐτὸς ὁ πατὴρ περὶ τούτου διαμάχονται, ὅπως ὡς βέλτιστος ἔσται ὁ παῖς, παρʼ ἕκαστον καὶ ἔργον καὶ λόγον διδάσκοντες καὶ ἐνδεικνύμενοι ὅτι τὸ μὲν δίκαιον, τὸ δὲ ἄδικον, καὶ τόδε μὲν καλόν, τόδε δὲ αἰσχρόν, καὶ τόδε μὲν ὅσιον, τόδε δὲ ἀνόσιον, καὶ τὰ μὲν ποίει, τὰ δὲ μὴ ποίει.
As soon as anyone understands what is said, both nurse and mother and tutor (pedagogue) and the father himself fight about this, how the child may be as good as possible, teaching and showing at every deed and word that this is just, and that is unjust, and this is beautiful, and that is ugly, and this is holy, and that is unholy, and 'do this' and 'do not do that'.
καὶ ἐὰν μὲν ἑκὼν πείθηται· εἰ δὲ μή, ὥσπερ ξύλον διαστρεφόμενον καὶ καμπτόμενον εὐθύνουσιν ἀπειλαῖς καὶ πληγαῖς.
And if he obeys willingly, it is well; but if not, like a warped and bent piece of wood, they straighten him with threats and blows.
μετὰ δὲ ταῦτα εἰς διδασκάλων πέμποντες πολὺ μᾶλλον ἐντέλλονται ἐπιμελεῖσθαι εὐκοσμίας τῶν παίδων ἢ γραμμάτων τε καὶ κιθαρίσεως·
And after this, sending them to teachers, they charge them much more to care for the good behavior of the children than for letters and lyre-playing;