§130ΣΩ. καὶ τούτων αὖ τῶν ἐπιδιδόντων οἱ μὲν καὶ βέβαιον ἔχουσι καὶ παραμόνιμον τὴν ὠφελίαν· πολλοὶ δέ, ὅσον ἂν μετʼ ἐμοῦ χρόνον ὦσιν, θαυμάσιον ἐπιδιδόασιν, ἐπειδὰν δέ μου ἀπόσχωνται, πάλιν οὐδὲν διαφέρουσιν ὁτουοῦν.
Socrates: And again, of these who make progress some possess the benefit as stable and permanent; but many, for as long a time as they are with me, make wonderful progress, but when they part from me, they are again no different from anyone else.
τοῦτό ποτε ἔπαθεν Ἀριστείδης ὁ Λυσιμάχου ὑὸς τοῦ Ἀριστείδου.
This is what once happened to Aristides, the son of Lysimachus, the grandson of Aristides.
διατρίβων γὰρ μετʼ ἐμοῦ πάμπολυ ἐπεδεδώκει ἐν ὀλίγῳ χρόνῳ· ἔπειτα αὐτῷ στρατεία τις ἐγένετο καὶ ᾤχετο ἐκπλέων, ἥκων δὲ κατελάμβανε μετʼ ἐμοῦ διατρίβοντα Θουκυδίδην τὸν Μελησίου ὑὸν τοῦ Θουκυδίδου.
For by spending time with me he had made very great progress in a short time; then a certain expedition arose for him and he departed, sailing away, and on his return he found Thucydides, the son of Melesias, the grandson of Thucydides, spending time with me.
ὁ δὲ Θουκυδίδης τῇ προτεραίᾳ μοι διʼ ἀπεχθείας ἐν λόγοις τισὶν ἐγεγόνει· ἰδὼν οὖν με ὁ Ἀριστείδης, ἐπειδὴ ἠσπάσατό τε καὶ τἆλλα διελέχθη,
Θουκυδίδην δέ,
ἔφη,
ἀκούω, ὦ Σώκρατες, σεμνύνεσθαι ἄττα πρός σε καὶ χαλεπαίνειν ὡς τὶ ὄντα.
Now Thucydides on the previous day had got into a dispute with me in some discussion; so Aristides, seeing me, when he had greeted me and conversed about other matters, said: "And Thucydides, Socrates," he said, "I hear, is putting on some grand airs towards you and is angry, as if he were somebody." "Indeed, it is so," I said.
ἔστι γάρ,
ἔφην ἐγώ,
οὕτως.
"What?" he said.
τί δέ, οὐκ οἶδεν,
ἔφη,
πρὶν σοὶ συγγενέσθαι οἷον ἦν τὸ ἀνδράποδον; οὐκ ἔοικέν γε,
ἔφην ἐγώ,
νὴ τοὺς θεούς.
"Does he not know, before associating with you, what sort of slave-like creature he was?" "It doesn't seem so, by the gods," I said.
ἀλλὰ μὴν καὶ αὐτός γε,
ἔφη,
καταγελάστως ἔχω, ὦ Σώκρατες.
"Yet indeed I too," he said, "am in a ridiculous state, Socrates.
τί μάλιστα; ἔφην ἐγώ.
"In what way especially?" I said.
ὅτι,
ἔφη,
πρὶν μὲν ἐκπλεῖν, ὁτῳοῦν ἀνθρώπῳ οἷός τʼ ἦ διαλέγεσθαι καὶ μηδενὸς χείρων φαίνεσθαι ἐν τοῖς λόγοις, ὥστε καὶ ἐδίωκον τὰς συνουσίας τῶν χαριεστάτων ἀνθρώπων, νυνὶ δὲ τοὐναντίον φεύγω ἄν τινα καὶ αἰσθάνωμαι πεπαιδευμένον· οὕτως αἰσχύνομαι ἐπὶ τῇ ἐμαυτοῦ φαυλότητι. πότερον δέ,
ἦν δʼ ἐγώ,
ἐξαίφνης σε προύλιπεν αὕτη ἡ δύναμις ἢ κατὰ σμικρόν; κατὰ σμικρόν,
ἦ δʼ ὅς.
"Because," he said, "before sailing away, I was able to converse with any person whatsoever and to appear second to none in discussions, so that I even sought out the associations of the most refined men; but now, on the contrary, I run away if I even perceive anyone who is educated, so ashamed am I of my own worthlessness." "And did this power leave you suddenly," I said, "or little by little?" "Little by little," he said.
ἡνίκα δέ σοι παρεγένετο,
ἦν δʼ ἐγώ,
πότερον μαθόντι παρʼ ἐμοῦ τι παρεγένετο ἤ τινι ἄλλῳ τρόπῳ; ἐγώ σοι ἐρῶ,
ἔφη,
ὦ Σώκρατες, ἄπιστον μὲν νὴ τοὺς θεούς, ἀληθὲς δέ.
"And when it was present with you," I said, "did it come to you because you learned something from me, or in some other way?" "I will tell you, Socrates," he said, "something unbelievable, by the gods, but true.
ἐγὼ γὰρ ἔμαθον μὲν παρά σου οὐδὲν πώποτε, ὡς αὐτὸς οἶσθα· ἐπεδίδουν δὲ ὁπότε σοι συνείην, κἂν εἰ ἐν τῇ αὐτῇ μόνον οἰκίᾳ εἴην, μὴ ἐν τῷ αὐτῷ δὲ οἰκήματι, μᾶλλον δὲ ὁπότε ἐν τῷ αὐτῷ οἰκήματι, καὶ ἔμοιγε ἐδόκουν πολὺ μᾶλλον ὁπότε ἐν τῷ αὐτῷ οἰκήματι ὢν λέγοντός σου βλέποιμι πρὸς σέ, μᾶλλον ἢ ὁπότε ἄλλοσε ὁρῴην, πολὺ δὲ μάλιστα καὶ πλεῖστον ἐπεδίδουν ὁπότε παρʼ αὐτόν σε καθοίμην ἐχόμενός σου καὶ ἁπτόμενος·
For I never learned anything from you, as you yourself know; yet I made progress whenever I was with you, even if I were only in the same house and not in the same room, but more so when I was in the same room, and it seemed to me far more so when being in the same room, while you were speaking, I looked at you, rather than when I looked elsewhere; and by far the most and greatest progress I made when I sat right next to you, holding on to you and touching you.
νῦν δέ,
ἦ δʼ ὅς,
πᾶσα ἐκείνη ἡ ἕξις ἐξερρύηκε. ἔστιν οὖν, ὦ Θέαγες, τοιαύτη ἡ ἡμετέρα συνουσία· ἐὰν μὲν τῷ θεῷ φίλον ᾖ, πάνυ πολὺ ἐπιδώσεις καὶ ταχύ, εἰ δὲ μή, οὔ.
But now," he said, "all that state has flown away." "Such, then, Theages, is our association: if it is pleasing to the god, you will make very great progress and quickly; but if not, you will not.
ὅρα οὖν μή σοι ἀσφαλέστερον ᾖ παρʼ ἐκείνων τινὶ παιδεύεσθαι οἳ ἐγκρατεῖς αὐτοί εἰσιν τῆς ὠφελίας ἣν ὠφελοῦσιν τοὺς ἀνθρώπους μᾶλλον ἢ παρʼ ἐμοῦ ὅτι ἂν τύχῃ τοῦτο πρᾶξαι. §131ΘΕ. ἐμοὶ μὲν τοίνυν δοκεῖ, ὦ Σώκρατες, ἡμᾶς οὑτωσὶ ποιῆσαι, ἀποπειραθῆναι τοῦ δαιμονίου τούτου συνόντας ἀλλήλοις.
Look to it, therefore, whether it might not be safer for you to be educated by one of those who are themselves masters of the benefit which they bestow on men, rather than by me, since whatever happens, this is how it acts." Theages: To me then, Socrates, it seems best for us to do this: to make trial of this daimonion by associating with each other.
καὶ ἐὰν μὲν παρείκῃ ἡμῖν, ταῦτα βέλτιστα· εἰ δὲ μή, τότε ἤδη παραχρῆμα βουλευσόμεθα ὅτι δράσομεν, εἴτε ἄλλῳ συνεσόμεθα, εἴτε καὶ αὐτὸ τὸ θεῖον τὸ σοὶ γιγνόμενον πειρασόμεθα παραμυθεῖσθαι εὐχαῖσί τε καὶ θυσίαις καὶ ἄλλῳ ὅτῳ ἂν οἱ μάντεις ἐξηγῶνται.
And if it yields to us, that will be best; but if not, then at that very moment we shall deliberate on what we will do, whether we shall associate with someone else, or whether we shall try to propitiate the divine power itself that comes to you, with prayers and sacrifices and whatever else the prophets may prescribe.
ΔΗ. μηκέτι πρὸς ταῦτα ἀντείπῃς, ὦ Σώκρατες, τῷ μειρακίῳ· εὖ γὰρ λέγει Θεάγης.
Demodocus: Do not object to these things any longer, Socrates, to the youth; for Theages speaks well.
ΣΩ. ἀλλʼ εἰ δοκεῖ χρῆναι οὕτω ποιεῖν, οὕτω ποιῶμεν.
Socrates: Well, if it seems necessary to do so, let us do so.